Work just withdrew my maternity pay

bugslet

sangie595 wrote: »

If you are the nicest possible employer, why would you damn someone for being a union member and asking their union for support. Seems a little contradictory. And if you are the nicest possible employer the union are going to be very happy about that and want to have constructive relationships with you. Good employers are something we value. The advice I have just given the OP would probably be the exact same advice I would give a member. But that member, stuck in a hospital, emotional and worrying over her baby, may appreciate someone else having that conversation. You'd judge the fairness of the situation your HR department created purely based on the fact that she asked her union rep to talk to you? Now that doesn't sound like a fair or rational employer. Which surprises me because you usually make sense!

I don't damn someone for being a union member.

AFAIK, only one of my staff is a union member, and when he had a problem, he came to me and we sorted the problem out in a mutually satisfactory way.

As I mentioned before, any dealings I have had with unions before have been unpleasant, intimidating, with the odd dollop of violence thrown in. I do of course 'recognise that unions have changed from the 70s, but early exposure has left me with a significant dislike of unions. If that's irrational so be it; but speaking purely personally, after 26 years I've only had one significant staff issue* and I do genuinely try to look after my staff. They seem to cope with my irrationality and quirks!

*bullying by one member of staff to another. It w as known about previously but unless someone makes a complaint or we had evidence, we can't randomly decide to take issue with said bully. He would have benefiitted from being in a union instead of using a no win no fee lawyer.

sangie595

bugslet wrote: »

I don't damn someone for being a union member.

AFAIK, only one of my staff is a union member, and when he had a problem, he came to me and we sorted the problem out in a mutually satisfactory way.

As I mentioned before, any dealings I have had with unions before have been unpleasant, intimidating, with the odd dollop of violence thrown in. I do of course 'recognise that unions have changed from the 70s, but early exposure has left me with a significant dislike of unions. If that's irrational so be it; but speaking purely personally, after 26 years I've only had one significant staff issue* and I do genuinely try to look after my staff. They seem to cope with my irrationality and quirks!

*bullying by one member of staff to another. It w as known about previously but unless someone makes a complaint or we had evidence, we can't randomly decide to take issue with said bully. He would have benefiitted from being in a union instead of using a no win no fee lawyer.

Well, you see, I have been in unions a lot longer than 26 years, and yes I have seen violence - most often AGAINST union members, not caused by them. And unpleasantness, and intimidation... Usually from employers. But I don't start from a position of believing all employers are like that, and that past experience dictates current strategies. If I did I would never get anything done. No, I am not opposed to striking. As a last resort, when people feel driven too it, then withholding their labour is their right. The same for other industrial action. But if this is the first line of defence, not the last, then it loses its effectiveness anyway. I would much prefer a reasonable talk with an employer, and so would my colleagues. None of us think all employers are bad. None of us think all our members are angels.

And many good employers agree. In fact many prefer a unionised workplace. It means that they know who to talk to, they can develop a relationship with those people (and I do not mean trying to buy them off!), and there is often more honesty in the relationship. There are workplaces that I can walk into, many of them, where I know that I can come out with something. It may not always be what I want, but it probably won't be what the employer wants either. We respect each other, but that doesn't mean we are in the employers pockets, or that we won't draw a line we can't cross. And a lot of the time that relationship stands us in better circumstances than the law does - because most of our work is about things the law does not dictate. And collective agreements are an employers dream - discuss once, done and dusted.

So I work on the basis that I would prefer to let the employer tell me that they are b*****ds before I give back like for like. Same as I judge anyone else - by who they are, not by the categories they belong to.

bugslet

I do like you an awful lot sangie, and would never be offended by your comments.

But, going back further than the 26 years to the late 60s/ early 70s and watching a jeering mob attack my lovely Dad, sorry, rationally it shouldnt affect now, but it does.

I went to the funeral of one of my ex drivers last week, both the celebrant and his widow commented on how much he loved his last job with us.

The last time I was down at my Southern depot, my youngest driver (very few firms support young drivers but we have done), said he'd not stay a driver if I finished because he couldn't get another job like it. My newest driver said he wished that he'd known about this place ten years ago, then paused and said that he wouldn't have realised how good it was.

Latest pay rise was well above average, we pay through breaks which less than 25% of firms do, my van drivers are on more than some arctic drivers.

I've worked for some miserable nasty companies and I make sure that I don't run one. People generally think that a business.ess is run because someone wants to earn loadsa money, that was never my motivation.

We aren't going to agree on this subject, probably better to stick with the 90% of things we do agree on:)

sangie595

bugslet wrote: »

I do like you an awful lot sangie, and would never be offended by your comments.

But, going back further than the 26 years to the late 60s/ early 70s and watching a jeering mob attack my lovely Dad, sorry, rationally it shouldnt affect now, but it does.

I went to the funeral of one of my ex drivers last week, both the celebrant and his widow commented on how much he loved his last job with us.

The last time I was down at my Southern depot, my youngest driver (very few firms support young drivers but we have done), said he'd not stay a driver if I finished because he couldn't get another job like it. My newest driver said he wished that he'd known about this place ten years ago, then paused and said that he wouldn't have realised how good it was.

Latest pay rise was well above average, we pay through breaks which less than 25% of firms do, my van drivers are on more than some arctic drivers.

I've worked for some miserable nasty companies and I make sure that I don't run one. People generally think that a business.ess is run because someone wants to earn loadsa money, that was never my motivation.

We aren't going to agree on this subject, probably better to stick with the 90% of things we do agree on:)

And I do believe that you are a good employer, And try to be. The difference is that I don't let what entirely other people in entirely different circumstances did force me into prejudices against everyone I consider had that hat on. But regardless, the majority of people don't have you as an employer - and have nobody but a union who can support and advise them. And despite what you said, I don't actually believe you! I think that if I had rung got up and explained what had happened and what was going on, I think you'd be mortified one of your employees had screwed up so badly, and left someone in this position, and I think you'd have done something about it. Even though "the union" talked to you. Because I can understand your anger - as I can also understand some of the anger of unions back then, who were also someone's lovely dads (and mothers). But you don't strike me as the sort of person who would let that get in the way of doing what is right and fair.

Kayalana99

bugslet wrote: »

I do like you an awful lot sangie, and would never be offended by your comments.

But, going back further than the 26 years to the late 60s/ early 70s and watching a jeering mob attack my lovely Dad, sorry, rationally it shouldnt affect now, but it does.

I went to the funeral of one of my ex drivers last week, both the celebrant and his widow commented on how much he loved his last job with us.

The last time I was down at my Southern depot, my youngest driver (very few firms support young drivers but we have done), said he'd not stay a driver if I finished because he couldn't get another job like it. My newest driver said he wished that he'd known about this place ten years ago, then paused and said that he wouldn't have realised how good it was.

Latest pay rise was well above average, we pay through breaks which less than 25% of firms do, my van drivers are on more than some arctic drivers.

I've worked for some miserable nasty companies and I make sure that I don't run one. People generally think that a business.ess is run because someone wants to earn loadsa money, that was never my motivation.

We aren't going to agree on this subject, probably better to stick with the 90% of things we do agree on:)

None of this matters at all, it's silly to hold a grudge on all of unions because of a bad past experience (that happened over 26 years ago? :eek:)

As you said unions have come on, and it should only get to a union as a last resort anyway....so to get petty for silly reasons actually just shows what sort of person you are. Doesn't really matter what X person and Y person say, if deep down someone pushes the wrong button you are just going to go kaboom and do anything possible to cause hassle...

CakeCrusader

It's not fair that they have confirmed your Maternity Pay three times, and then withdrawn it as they made a mistake. You were clearly relying upon this so that you can support your family. They have something called 'reasonable reliance' in Contract Law (Employment is a contract for services, so this should apply);

"particularly in contracts, what a prudent person would believe and act upon if told something by another. Typically, a person is promised a profit or other benefit, and in reliance takes steps in reliance on the promise, only to find the statements or promises were not true or were exaggerated. The one who relied can recover damages for the costs of his/her actions or demand performance if the reliance was "reasonable." " http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=1732

It's worth seeking legal advice, but you'll need to be quick. Most household insurance companies have Legal Assistance so it may be worth checking your policy. I'd hold off applying for Maternity Allowance until you've sought proper legal advice. Congratulations on the birth of your little one.

bugslet

As I said way back sangie, if it were me, she'd be getting paid because the deal had been done and its fair.

Kayalana99 wrote: »

None of this matters at all, it's silly to hold a grudge on all of unions because of a bad past experience (that happened over 26 years ago? :eek:)

As you said unions have come on, and it should only get to a union as a last resort anyway....so to get petty for silly reasons actually just shows what sort of person you are. Doesn't really matter what X person and Y person say, if deep down someone pushes the wrong button you are just going to go kaboom and do anything possible to cause hassle...

Well no one has involved a union ever and they are free to. Possibly because we can all manage to talk to each other without outside intervention.

So I'm happy, my staff are happy but people who don't work with me aren't happy. I think I can live with that.

xapprenticex

I think its harsh that OP start a job pregnant then tell them she's having a baby a few months later (Its hard enough for women) and i think its harsh that the company promise her free money but renege on the offer.