How to contract 4 on 4 off with differing working hours at weekends

Haypops

Hi All,

Totally confused as to how to contract two new staff. members We are hiring 2 x admin personnel that will need to cover Monday to Friday x 5 hrs (5.5hrs worked but 0.5hr unpaid break) and Saturday and Sundays are a 10 hr stint each. No deduction for break. Sometimes they will finsih earlier but we still pay the 10hrs usually.

We want to contract them around 25hrs p/w and were thinking of a 4 on 4 off working pattern. I can't get the figures to work.

Help would be much appreciated.

How do the holidays work?

Thanks

paddedjohn

Mon, Tue, Wed in, Thur, Fri off, Sat, Sun in.

paddedjohn

For holidays you would need them to provide cover for each other or find a third person to cover them.

theoretica

Do you particularly want people on a rota system? Many people prefer fixed hours. Wouldn't it be simpler to have one person in M-F and one S and S? Or one person Sun- Wed and th other Thurs - Sat? Perhaps even giving your employees some scope to propose other splits.

Haypops wrote: »

Saturday and Sundays are a 10 hr stint each. No deduction for break.

But they will be able to take their legally mandated break? You may also have a problem with holidays if one person is on holiday and the other expected to work 7 days a week. You may occasionally need agency staff for to cover holidays.

jobbingmusician

sooo... these breaks. Workers have to have a minimum break of 20 mins if they work over 6 hours. It feels a bit mean to force people working a 5 hour shift to have a half hour unpaid break.

If you are trying to cover 5 hours on normal working days, and 10 hours on weekends, then this is a total of 45 hours, and each worker would have a 22.5 hour contract, assuming you want the 2 workers to have equal hours. IN ADDITION to this, you should really assume 5% holidays (which you HAVE to give) and 5% sickness/training.

A worker working 22.5 hours will be entitled to 5.6 x 22.5 hours annual leave as a minimum.

You could solve the problem of breaks on Sats/Suns by making these a split shift, with each worker doing 5 hours on each of these days, and weekends being core hours for the job. (I'm not saying this idea will be popular! Might you consider having a larger admin team or an 'as and when' bank worker to cover as needed? A long term committed bank worker works well for my organisation.)

getmore4less

jobbingmusician wrote: »

sooo... these breaks. Workers have to have a minimum break of 20 mins if they work over 6 hours. It feels a bit mean to force people working a 5 hour shift to have a half hour unpaid break.

If you are trying to cover 5 hours on normal working days, and 10 hours on weekends, then this is a total of 45 hours, and each worker would have a 22.5 hour contract, assuming you want the 2 workers to have equal hours. IN ADDITION to this, you should really assume 5% holidays (which you HAVE to give) and 5% sickness/training.

A worker working 22.5 hours will be entitled to 5.6 x 22.5 hours annual leave as a minimum.

You could solve the problem of breaks on Sats/Suns by making these a split shift, with each worker doing 5 hours on each of these days, and weekends being core hours for the job. (I'm not saying this idea will be popular! Might you consider having a larger admin team or an 'as and when' bank worker to cover as needed? A long term committed bank worker works well for my organisation.)

5.6 weeks out of 52 is nearer 11%

getmore4less

You can't really cover a 7/52 4-4 with 2 people as you need to cover holidays and ideally some contingency for sick,

If people have to cover each other they are really contracted to more than 4-4.

Contrary to what many think you can cover the holidays by having people work for 7+ days in a row, the longest stretch the WTR regulations allow is 24 days in a row(with 2 days off at each end).

4-4 is a 16 week cycle if you want to do the numbers for that.

might be an idea to have a few alternatives in case you can't find 2 people that want to do 4-4

another way is to have each person do alternate weekends and fill in the other days with a 2 week cycle
eg. 2 on, 3 off, 2 on, 2 off, 3 on, 2 off.

For a fully flexible alternative annualized hours days.

if weekday hours are suitable for people with kids you may want to consider term time as an option.

Will the job need lots of continuity/handover or is it a turn up anyone could do it type of position.

jobbingmusician

getmore4less wrote: »

5.6 weeks out of 52 is nearer 11%

Quite right, sorry, should have said at least 10%. A while since I did these calcs!

I also assumed that the OP needs 10 hours continuous admin cover at the weekends, without a break. If lunch can be accommodated, then alternate weekends is a possibility. 10 hours' working without a break is not allowed, however!

getmore4less

I just assumed paid break(s) rather than unpaid as that is what they said.

Monday to Friday x 5 hrs (5.5hrs worked but 0.5hr unpaid break) and Saturday and Sundays are a 10 hr stint each. No deduction for break

jobbingmusician

getmore4less wrote: »

I just assumed paid break(s) rather than unpaid as that is what they said.

What the OP wrote could be understood either way. As they are not paying for breaks during the shorter shift, I assumed that they were proposing not to have a break in the long shift. Obviously if their 'admin' are the front line reception people, they are likely to need someone there all the time - but maybe I misunderstood.