MSE Poll: What should be means-tested? Free bus passes, the NHS, student loans?

Andyjj

You'd be surprised how easy it would be. HMRC deal with a wide range of means tested benefits. Tax credits are an example. Child benefit and state pensions are huge areas that would require little infrastructure to implement

MacMickster

The easiest way to means test these things without creating huge new bureaucracies and more form filling is to simply add a couple of pence to the basic rate of income tax then provide them all for "free".

borkid

XRAT wrote: »

I'd like to see the system change to encourage those who need money to go and earn it. Instead of paying benefits I would allow the personal tax allowance threshold to be raised (as it is with the marriage allowance at the moment.)
If you work you keep more of it, if you don't work you don't get.
Means testing is too easily 'gamed' by the experts. We have too many experts with time on their hands. (Given a days work most criminals are too tired to go looking for easy pickings at night.)
Bus passes should be free to the elderly outside of rush hours. It encourages mobility and eases congestion. But first, councils should clear foot paths so the infirm can get to the bus-stop! (Billing residents if private trees/shrubs need to be cut.)

They can only be used after 9:30 now unless the last bus is before 9:30 and then it can be used on that one.

LesD

...for 'abolished altogether'?

As many others have said, 'means testing' for any type of subsidy penalises those who have managed their lives properly so they have adequate resources.

It also costs money - which, of course, everyone else pays for.

So, if subsidies really are needed, pay them to all. Otherwise, abolish them completely.

wooried

Let's have minimal means testing, and pay through it by taxing the income and profits of those who can afford it, both people and businesses

rowem

if you don't drive, a passport is about the only photo ID that you can have - or we could bring in ID cards for all?

JustExtreme

dastep wrote: »

The bible is clear about what exactly the role of government is there to do.

The main purpose of government is to restrain evil and that's all. This is done through many ways, police, justice system, eduction system through teachers interacting with parents, fire department, strong military, immigration services, airport security, etc.

Everything else that has been heaped upon government to the detriment of the taxpayer is manmade and never intended to be the responsibility of government.

For years, churches and charities took care of the needs of the poor and donations from wealthy industrialists endeavoured to fix many problems in society, but it wasn't until the 20th Century when what we now know as the welfare state came into being.

Because of this bloated welfare system, people don't depend upon their own ingenuity to earn a living, they turn to and demand that government make their dreams come true, and it's destroying our system and forcing hardworking people to prop up a very unfair system that takes from someone who has worked hard for their wages and gives it to a person who isn't working and doesn't deserve it.

If you truly want a FAIR system? Scrap 90% of all the welfare giveaways and force people to fend for themselves through family, friends, and Christian charities. Then taxes can be lowered and working folks could choose to donate to support the charity of their choice to help these people from the abundance of their earnings instead of the current mess that has been created by government bureaucrats that take and dole out to whom they please.

So what you're saying is that we should stick with constant fear of starvation and homelessness because it's an incentive to work, right? After all, there's no better, more humane and more desirable incentive than a constantly looming death threat. Yay capitalism!

When people don't have to work to survive and are free to choose to work for the sake of work and living they are more interested and engaged in their work and take more risks for innovation, are more charitable and compassionate towards each other, and quality of life goes up. Scrap the means testing and give everyone a guaranteed income/universal basiuc income instead.

Humans thrive under capitalism? Let's see. Oh looks like capitalism has somehow created simultaneously high obesity and malnourishing rates, more houses than homeless people, highest levels of stress ever, high life expectancy but high suicide rates, depression rates and opioid abuse rates. Looks like living in capitalism is so great people do everything to stop the pain of living longer in it. Huh.

Capitalism has incentives for innovation? Let's see how capitalism directly contributed to human progress. Whoops. Looks like if it wasn't for Tesla ripping off his contract with Westinghouse so he wouldn't go bankrupt we wouldn't even have electricity today, arguably the most important achievement of modern civilization, which has brought the most quality of life to the most people... Hey, there's more. Early computer hacker culture and Linux, the hardware and software backbones of our modern civilization, were based on anti-profit motives for the common good. Sounds awfully like communism to me... Oh hey, look at how public investment in science and technology was responsible for 90% of the seminal technology and medicine we rely on today. Oh, and look at all this fundamental research that wasn't done because of no profit motive, and the state had to intervene to back the bill. Oh look at all the cases in history where profit motives prevented medium/long term research that would have improved the lives of billions. Looks like capitalism naturally deprives us of innovation because it can only promote innovation if it can be profitable to a few rich individuals, not if it is cheap and good to all of us. I wonder which criterion is better... Hmm...

I really hope your post is satire and that you never have any influence on government policy.

Torry_Quine

borkid wrote: »

They can only be used after 9:30 now unless the last bus is before 9:30 and then it can be used on that one.

In Scotland there isn't a time restriction.

kathrynha

borkid wrote: »

They can only be used after 9:30 now unless the last bus is before 9:30 and then it can be used on that one.

The afternoon peak time is an issue too. When your tired after a long day at work, and are lucky to be able to get on the bus never mind get a seat, because of all the passengers that don't pay.
I gave up on public transport and now commute by car. Saves me time, money and sanity.

Spidernick

Surely pensioners on a bus rather than behind the wheel of a car is a good thing that should be encouraged? Many pensioners don't seem to know when they should stop driving and are a danger to themselves and others. Not all, but enough, which is why I see their free bus passes as a positive.