Unfair Dismissal during Probationary Period

ScorpiondeRooftrouser

Given that the job was going to be shift work, did you want to keep it?

Are you annoyed that they haven't kept you on and let you work shifts, or are you annoyed that they changed the terms of your employment to something you wouldn't have taken in the first place?

You have no legal comeback in either case. If it is the second thing you are annoyed about, then I think that by letting you go and paying you for a month, they have actually done quite well by you under the circumstances.

If you wanted to be kept on and work the shifts, then frankly you shouldn't have made so much of a fuss about it when it was obvious that was the way the job was going. Did you expect them to say "Oh ok, we'll change all our plans to suit you"?

Ozzuk

Take a step back, yes you are annoyed, yes this might be unfair -but they have given you a good offer.

What do you expect/want to happen? There is no way they are going to say 'oh you are right, have your old job back'.

inglorius

ScorpiondeRooftrouser wrote: »

Given that the job was going to be shift work, did you want to keep it?

Are you annoyed that they haven't kept you on and let you work shifts, or are you annoyed that they changed the terms of your employment to something you wouldn't have taken in the first place?

You have no legal comeback in either case. If it is the second thing you are annoyed about, then I think that by letting you go and paying you for a month, they have actually done quite well by you under the circumstances.

If you wanted to be kept on and work the shifts, then frankly you shouldn't have made so much of a fuss about it when it was obvious that was the way the job was going. Did you expect them to say "Oh ok, we'll change all our plans to suit you"?

Annoyance is a word I would not use, fundamentally I accepted the contract in good faith and said at the time that I had turned down another job offer of similar terms also working days to join the company, then within 5 minutes of me joining I was told I was working shifts without any notice. I was not asked at the time of being told I was going to be working shifts whether I was able to accommodate this due to out of work commitments such as childcare etc. On a secondary, less important note there was no conversation about receiving a shift premium for working the shift pattern I was asked to work which is common practice in my line of work.

If you consider all of these factors to be deemed as raising a fuss whereby I did raise my thoughts in a constructive manner AND agreed to work shifts in the interim after my line manager had always advocated open and honest 2 way feedback then as I said during my exit interview yesterday am not sure what the "correct" course of action should have been, obviously to not raise an imposed change to contractual conditions is the right answer.

Somerset

inglorius wrote: »

Annoyance is a word I would not use, fundamentally I accepted the contract in good faith and said at the time that I had turned down another job offer of similar terms also working days to join the company, then within 5 minutes of me joining I was told I was working shifts without any notice. I was not asked at the time of being told I was going to be working shifts whether I was able to accommodate this due to out of work commitments such as childcare etc. On a secondary, less important note there was no conversation about receiving a shift premium for working the shift pattern I was asked to work which is common practice in my line of work.

If you consider all of these factors to be deemed as raising a fuss whereby I did raise my thoughts in a constructive manner AND agreed to work shifts in the interim after my line manager had always advocated open and honest 2 way feedback then as I said during my exit interview yesterday am not sure what the "correct" course of action should have been, obviously to not raise an imposed change to contractual conditions is the right answer.

You are itemising legal employment maybe issues. They are irrelevant in your case because the only' question people ask first is, have you got your two years in. If you haven't, none of the above matters. They can dismiss you for no reason, any reason.


sangie595's response is correct and she knows a hell of a lot more than me about employment issues. Given an employer has a two year 'get out of jail free card' do you think they'll ditch the guy who's flexible and accepts, or difficult and says ''but my contract says'' ? That's the reality.

jobbingmusician

I suspect that a) the employee has a case for unfair dismissal* (contract has been breached) and b) the employer knows this, hence the sudden magic appearance of a month's salary and reference.

However, I would think carefully about whether to accept the employer's offer. Personally, I wouldn't want to work for an employer who behaved like this, and I would ensure that the employer provides a decent reference and take the offer (which presumably will not prevent the employee claiming benefits whilst they look for their next job).

*Yes, I really do mean unfair dismissal, which (as i understand it) can apply if the WTR are breached. Since the employee was also moved to shift work, a female might also have a good case for indirect sex discrimination.

Normal disclaimer ... I am not an expert.....

Guest101

jobbingmusician wrote: »

I suspect that a) the employee has a case for unfair dismissal* (contract has been breached) and b) the employer knows this, hence the sudden magic appearance of a month's salary and reference.

However, I would think carefully about whether to accept the employer's offer. Personally, I wouldn't want to work for an employer who behaved like this, and I would ensure that the employer provides a decent reference and take the offer (which presumably will not prevent the employee claiming benefits whilst they look for their next job).

*Yes, I really do mean unfair dismissal, which (as i understand it) can apply if the WTR are breached. Since the employee was also moved to shift work, a female might also have a good case for indirect sex discrimination.

Normal disclaimer ... I am not an expert.....

Can you explain why there would be gender discrimination with shift work? & What way the working time regs were breached?

Guest101

inglorius wrote: »

Annoyance is a word I would not use, fundamentally I accepted the contract in good faith and said at the time that I had turned down another job offer of similar terms also working days to join the company, then within 5 minutes of me joining I was told I was working shifts without any notice. I was not asked at the time of being told I was going to be working shifts whether I was able to accommodate this due to out of work commitments such as childcare etc. On a secondary, less important note there was no conversation about receiving a shift premium for working the shift pattern I was asked to work which is common practice in my line of work.

If you consider all of these factors to be deemed as raising a fuss whereby I did raise my thoughts in a constructive manner AND agreed to work shifts in the interim after my line manager had always advocated open and honest 2 way feedback then as I said during my exit interview yesterday am not sure what the "correct" course of action should have been, obviously to not raise an imposed change to contractual conditions is the right answer.

They didn't want you working there, you didn't fit in with the business needs.


Move on

Alice_Walker

jobbingmusician wrote: »

I suspect that a) the employee has a case for unfair dismissal* (contract has been breached) and b) the employer knows this, hence the sudden magic appearance of a month's salary and reference.

However, I would think carefully about whether to accept the employer's offer. Personally, I wouldn't want to work for an employer who behaved like this, and I would ensure that the employer provides a decent reference and take the offer (which presumably will not prevent the employee claiming benefits whilst they look for their next job).

*Yes, I really do mean unfair dismissal, which (as i understand it) can apply if the WTR are breached. Since the employee was also moved to shift work, a female might also have a good case for indirect sex discrimination.

Normal disclaimer ... I am not an expert.....

Anyone that pulls the sex discrimination card for a situation like this is doing all women a disservice. This is nothing to do with the OP being a woman, it's to do with the needs of the business.

(There is case law that broadly says shift work affects women more than men because they are more likely to have childcare needs, and hence it may be indirect discrimination. In my opinion it is cases like this (and the people that bring such cases) that set women's rights back years - we want to be treated as equals in the workplace, and that won't happen when employers exercise caution in fear of the next frivolous discrimination complaint.)

daytona0

Ignore what the employer did for a second...

You were only there for 3 weeks before you started questioning the way they did things... You have to be careful because they won't always support you after just 3 weeks on the job! ESPECIALLY if they are being told by their higher up bosses how to do things! You'd stand no chance I'm afraid. Can you honestly blame them for shipping you out?!

The optimal approach to situations like this is to keep your mouth shut whilst working hard to find a more suitable role. By opening your mouth you've cost yourself a job which could tide you over till a more suitable one came about. Life lesson I'm afraid.

As for the legalities of it, you need to have been employed for 2+ years or been discriminated against (protected characteristic). You haven't been. And don't listen to the person who said gender, because a male doing what you did would also not fit in with their shift requirements and would have been turfed out too.

Scorpio33

I had the same thing happen to me and learnt the hard way.


My old boss said "I don't even look at contracts, they are meaningless".


That was my biggest frustration - they can do what they like basically within the first 2 years of employment. Even changing your terms without you agreeing to them.


The good employers won't do this, but there is nothing you can do now apart from find a new (better) job.


It all worked out for me - the new employer paid me 20% more, treated me better and I was a lot happier there.