UKCPM Charging £100 For A Space I've Already Paid For!

UKCPM_Victim

I'd be extremely grateful to anyone who would be kind enough to read the below and offer some advice!

I pay an annual fee for a parking space at my flat. The car park is run by UKCPM and they require that your permit be displayed at all times. Unfortunately (and inevitably) one day, my permit fell out of view and was promptly issued a £100 parking "charge" and I sent the following appeal:

Dear Sir/Madam,
Thank you for your letter dated 12th July 2016. As the driver of this company vehicle at the time this PCN was issued, I was notified of your letter to my employer yesterday, 18th July.
I am writing to inform you that I believe your parking charge was issued unfairly. I am not liable for the amount payable because your parking charge needs to reflect a loss suffered by the business caused by my parking. The parking space in question was one for which I paid an annual fee, and is allocated to myself only. As such, the parking charge has already been paid and the business cannot demonstrate any loss of income resulting from this, and the charge would therefore constitute an unenforceable penalty.
I do, however, agree that my parking permit should have been properly displayed as per the rules of the car park. Consequently, I am happy to cover the administration cost incurred by yourselves for issuing the Parking Charge Notice. I am comfortable to pay an administration fee of up to £15. If this is agreeable, please write back to me at the address above, and mark the letter for my attention.

Thank you for your time,

[My Name]


Here is the reply I received from my appeal.


Dear [My Name],

I am writing in reponse to your letter received 20th July 2016.

Unfortunately, the amount outstanding will remain at £100.00, you have also accepted liability in your letter confirming you are aware that your permit needs to be displayed at all times.

You stated in your letter that the charge needs to reflect the loss suffered by the business, unfortunately this statement is incorrect. On 4th November 2015 the Supreme Court made Judgment in favour of the parking company over the motorist. They ruled that "the parking charge is neither extravagant nor unconscionable." Having found that the charge was not excessive and reflected a deterrent rather than being extravagant. This latest ruling has brought a rapid cease to the propagated debate concerning genuine pre-estimate of loss. Therefore your claims of a disproportionate fee not reflecting a genuine pre estimate of loss cannot be used as a reason for not paying the full outstanding.

I encourage you to look into the below publicised case as the Judgment delivers much needed clarity to motorists, landowners and the Parking Industry and is binding upon the Small Claims Court, the High court and any Independent Appeals Service. A dull copy of the judgement can be found here:
[not allowed to post link as I'm a new user but this can be found by Googling "Cavendish Square Holding BV v Talal El Makdessi" and clicking the first result]

To avoid incurring additional charges you are required to make the outstanding payment without delay. Parking Charges that are not paid in full are pursued through a Debt Recovery Agency.

Yours sincerely,

A Crowle
UK Car Park Management Ltd
0845 463 5050

Can anyone recommend a course of action here? Much appreciated everyone.

The_Slithy_Tove

1. They are right in that no Genuine Pre-Estimate of Loss is pretty much a dead duck when it comes to appeals, but
2. Your case differs hugely from the Beavis case heard in the Supreme Court. For a start, what kind of "deterrent" are they talking about? You were entitled to park, and pay already for the privilege; this is not a retail car park where turnover of vehicles is important.

You should have started with the NEWBIES sticky and gone from there.

It would be interesting to see exactly what the signage says, as if they are trying to get to into a contract to park your car, you already have one of those (by virtue of the payment you make), so they can't offer something you already have the right to.

dazster

It's unfortunate that you told them that you accept you should've displayed the permit.

Your strongest defence here is that you have a contract for the use of the space with whomever you pay the £100 to. Accordingly you do not need UK-CPM's permission to use the space, so UK-CPM has nothing it can offer you as consideration and there can be no contract between you and UK-CPM.

You could write to both UK-CPM and the managing agent stating that you are the lawful occupier of the parking space, that UK-CPM is trespassing when it tickets your car, and also that they are committing a private nuisance in seeking to interfere with your rights over the parking space. Tell them that they must cease and desist these tortious acts otherwise you may bring a case for damages in the County Court (and explain to the managing agent that they are liable for the actions of their agent, UK-CPM).

fisherjim

" Having found that the charge was not excessive and reflected a deterrent rather than being extravagant."

You have to wonder also why they think they have the right, or need to deter you from parking in your own parking space.

Couldn't possibly be just to scam you out of money.

The threat of a "debt recovery agency" is like saying we may get someone to send you pictures of kittens through the post!

The_Deep

Warn them that, unless they withdraw their claim and apologise, you will be invoicing them for any time you spend dealing with an appeal/court appearance.

UKCPM_Victim

For anyone interested, I wrote to them yesterday with the following reply:

To A Crowle,
Thank you for your reply. Unfortunately, I still believe that the £100 invoice was issued unfairly.
In your letter you refer to the case of Parking Eye vs Beavis, which differs hugely from this case. Firstly, your claim that the charge is a “deterrent” is absurd as I am entitled to park in the space in question, and I pay already for the privilege; this is not a retail car park where turnover of vehicles in important. I pay an annual fee to use this space, as part of a contract with my landlord and as such, I am the lawful occupier of this space.
If you do not cease and desist sending these invalid and tortious claims for payment, I will be invoicing your company for any time I spend dealing with an appeal/court appearance.

Yours sincerely

[My Name]

System

You could write to both UK-CPM and the managing agent stating that you are the lawful occupier of the parking space, that UK-CPM is trespassing when it tickets your car, and also that they are committing a private nuisance in seeking to interfere with your rights over the parking space. Tell them that they must cease and desist these tortious acts otherwise you may bring a case for damages in the County Court (and explain to the managing agent that they are liable for the actions of their agent, UK-CPM).

As Dazster pointed out in #3, your issue is with the MA. UKCPM has provided no consideration. So there cannot have been a contract as the parking space you were "offered" by UKCPM was your own.

Put the question of what do UKCPM offer someone who has paid for the space to the MA and come back with what they reply. You may be going to court depending on the reply, but you'll be in the driving seat.

bod1467

UKCPM_Victim wrote: »

If you do not cease and desist sending these invalid and tortuous claims for payment

Dealing with PPCs can be like that.

(You meant tortious)

The_Deep

The numpties should have taken the £15, they are now likely to have to spend £££ to get the OP off their back.

UKCPM_Victim

Thanks for the ongoing help, everyone. This shady industry of "parking companies" needs to be dealt with. Has anyone considered starting an online petition via petition.parliament.uk?

What's likely to happen next? They haven't replied so far but I've got a bad feeling that I'll find a CCJ in my credit report this time next year!

Umkomaas

UKCPM_Victim wrote: »

Thanks for the ongoing help, everyone. This shady industry of "parking companies" needs to be dealt with. Has anyone considered starting an online petition via petition.parliament.uk?

What's likely to happen next? They haven't replied so far but I've got a bad feeling that I'll find a CCJ in my credit report this time next year!

There have been many, all fizzled out.

The Government launched a consultation about 12 months ago. Said they would announce the results in April this year .... still waiting.

Check 'Challenge the Fine' website

Check ParkingEye -v- Barry Beavis.

Why do you think you will find a CCJ in your credit report next year - please do tell.