hmrc new rules on applying for UTR

strong8096

ive been chasing UTRs for people that submitted SA1s online some over 5 weeks ago, today apparently rules have changed and those that are PAYE but can claim expenses even if over £2500 if its the first time registering must fill in a P87 then after 6 weeks of them assessing this will then tell you they are setting up a file for SA and ask you to file, according to 3 different idiots today this has been in place a few weeks now, but Friday I could get them to register people for this exact reason, oh and I informed them they might need to update their website and phone information, also they said register to view your personal account and file the p87 that way, um HELLO tried it that way but of course saying invalid, expenses greater than £2500 please register for self assessment, seriously anyone else getting this bull crap from them at present

CakeCrusader

They are being really slow at the moment. I filled my SA1 5 weeks ago and they've still not adjusted my tax code. I've called them today and they adjusted my tax code for my PAYE expenses, but not for my self employed expenses.

I'm due to get paid on Thursday, so I don't think there's enough time for them to get in touch with my employer to change my tax code this month

Dazed_and_confused

CakeCrusader wrote: »

They are being really slow at the moment. I filled my SA1 5 weeks ago and they've still not adjusted my tax code. I've called them today and they adjusted my tax code for my PAYE expenses, but not for my self employed expenses.

I'm due to get paid on Thursday, so I don't think there's enough time for them to get in touch with my employer to change my tax code this month

Why did you think completing the SA1 would result in an adjustment to your tax code?

Why would HMRC include your self employment expenses in your tax code?

CakeCrusader

Dazed_and_confused wrote: »

Why did you think completing the SA1 would result in an adjustment to your tax code?

Why would HMRC include your self employment expenses in your tax code?

I was self employed and PAYE last tax year. I can offset my SE loss and it gets repaid through my tax code.

Wayne_O_Mac

strong8096 wrote: »

according to 3 different idiots today

Well aren't you quite the charmer.

[Deleted User]

CakeCrusader wrote: »

I was self employed and PAYE last tax year. I can offset my SE loss and it gets repaid through my tax code.

A loss can be carried back, set off against other total income of the same year or carried forward against future TRADING profits. That seems an odd way to get a refund after loss set off - why can you not receive the whole repayment in one lump sum?

Dazed_and_confused

[Deleted User] wrote:

A loss can be carried back, set off against other total income of the same year or carried forward against future TRADING profits. That seems an odd way to get a refund after loss set off - why can you not receive the whole repayment in one lump sum?

I'm not sure CakeCrusader really knows what he/she is doing as one hand they are unhappy about a 5 week delay whilst on the other they appear happy to get a tax refund drip fed back to them over the next 35-40 weeks or so rather than get a lump sum paid straight into their bank account :rotfl:

CakeCrusader

[Deleted User] wrote:

A loss can be carried back, set off against other total income of the same year or carried forward against future TRADING profits. That seems an odd way to get a refund after loss set off - why can you not receive the whole repayment in one lump sum?

There won't be any trading profits as I'm no longer self employed (PAYE is keeping me really busy so I don't have the time to look for new SE work). It was my last SA. I tried to get them to repay it in one lump sum last year and I lost the will to live at the end so they repayed it via my tax code. I'm having problems getting it off them this year too as they don't appear to have the ability to deduct a SE loss from my PAYE income (again).

[Deleted User]

CakeCrusader wrote: »

There won't be any trading profits as I'm no longer self employed (PAYE is keeping me really busy so I don't have the time to look for new SE work). It was my last SA. I tried to get them to repay it in one lump sum last year and I lost the will to live at the end so they repayed it via my tax code. I'm having problems getting it off them this year too as they don't appear to have the ability to deduct a SE loss from my PAYE income (again).

Sometimes this is the problem when one is not used to dealing with HMRC. Quite simply I would ring and demand that the repayment be issued in one payment. I have been working with them (inside and out) for 35 years and have never experienced a tax repayment for one year being drip fed through PAYE in the following year. That sounds to me like a complete misreading of loss relief rules. Time for a complaint I would suggest!

Or - did you actually claim the loss to be set off against income of the same year or leave this box blank? If left blank the default position would be to carry forward. If no trading income the following year - we have the confused situation that you are now in. You have until 31January 2017 to amend the return if necessary.

CakeCrusader

[Deleted User] wrote:

Sometimes this is the problem when one is not used to dealing with HMRC. Quite simply I would ring and demand that the repayment be issued in one payment. I have been working with them (inside and out) for 35 years and have never experienced a tax repayment for one year being drip fed through PAYE in the following year. That sounds to me like a complete misreading of loss relief rules. Time for a complaint I would suggest!

Or - did you actually claim the loss to be set off against income of the same year or leave this box blank? If left blank the default position would be to carry forward. If no trading income the following year - we have the confused situation that you are now in. You have until 31January 2017 to amend the return if necessary.

Ah, thank you! I filled it and the loss wasn't showing on the calculation, so I called and was told to submit it. I submitted it, and called again, and I was told to click on the 'offset against income' box in order to offset the loss against my PAYE. I suspect they messed it up last year too and I'm repaying tax to them that they've already refunded. Shame I can't just pop into the office and have a chat! Problem with them drip feeding last year's refund into my PAYE, is that I have PAYE expenses this year too.

[Deleted User]

I think that you should be thanking HMRC, not criticising them. HMRC have gone out of their way by telling you where to claim the loss and that is unusual as they cannot decide how to utilise the loss- this is a entry that should have been made by you. It appears that you have declared the loss but not claimed it by placing it in the correct box - it appears that HMRC has not 'messed up' at all. I repeat - self-employed loss relief is not granted by an adjustment to a tax code for a future year - at least never in my experience.