Irish Pension in the UK after Brexit

labrit

Hi,

I'm posting on behalf of a very worried friend. She's a dual citizen of the UK and Ireland and has lived over here in the UK for about 30 years but, as she worked for about 7 years in Ireland before moving here, she gets an Irish pension.

Her concern, post Brexit, is that she will no longer get ANY Irish state pension because we are no longer in the EU. Is that fear unfounded? I assume that she would receive an Irish pension (but that she'd get less money due to the lower exchange rate) but any assurances, or advice on where to go to get assurances, would be appreciated.

Many thanks.

Yours sincerely,

Anthony Armstrong

robber2

The situation would, I assume be similar to an Irish national living in, say Oz or the USA. She probably needs to check with irish pensions to find out.

She may not get less money, no one knows what the exchange rate will be when we finally split.

HappyMJ

labrit wrote: »

Hi,

I'm posting on behalf of a very worried friend. She's a dual citizen of the UK and Ireland and has lived over here in the UK for about 30 years but, as she worked for about 7 years in Ireland before moving here, she gets an Irish pension.

Her concern, post Brexit, is that she will no longer get ANY Irish state pension because we are no longer in the EU. Is that fear unfounded? I assume that she would receive an Irish pension (but that she'd get less money due to the lower exchange rate) but any assurances, or advice on where to go to get assurances, would be appreciated.

Many thanks.

Yours sincerely,

Anthony Armstrong

She would get more money.

If she was paid in GBP and wanted to spend in Euro's she would get less but as her pension is paid in Euro's and she wants to spend GBP's she will get more.

Malthusian

labrit wrote: »

Her concern, post Brexit, is that she will no longer get ANY Irish state pension because we are no longer in the EU. Is that fear unfounded?

Yes. 100%.

Not sure how else I can put it really.

I mean I feel like I should be setting out the reasons why it is false but it is difficult when there are no reasons why it could be true requiring a counterpoint.

People have gone so bonkers I half expect people to start asking "My wife / friend / dog thinks that because we have left the EU we will no longer have gravity and people will float up into the sky and asphyxiate, can anyone comment?"

If she went to live in America or Australia or Argentina, would her State Pension stop?

SkyeKnight

Malthusian wrote: »

Yes. 100%.

Not sure how else I can put it really.

I mean I feel like I should be setting out the reasons why it is false but it is difficult when there are no reasons why it could be true requiring a counterpoint.

People have gone so bonkers I half expect people to start asking "My wife / friend / dog thinks that because we have left the EU we will no longer have gravity and people will float up into the sky and asphyxiate, can anyone comment?"

If she went to live in America or Australia or Argentina, would her State Pension stop?

If a British person went to live in, say, Canada they would not get any yearly uprating in their pension. Similarly, whilst EU rules means that we get our full pension anywhere in the EU that no longer has to remain the case once we leave. She is right to be worried in my opinion, though I think Ireland and England are so close they are unlikely not to make a bilateral agreement once we leave.

greenglide

Surely UK and Ireland cannot reach a bilateral agreement, it will be an agreement between UK and all of the EU.

There would be no obvious reason for the present arrangement not continuing. I can't see either side having anything to gain from changing it.

SkyeKnight

greenglide wrote: »

Surely UK and Ireland cannot reach a bilateral agreement, it will be an agreement between UK and all of the EU.

There would be no obvious reason for the present arrangement not continuing. I can't see either side having anything to gain from changing it.

Yeah, you're right - it would be a British-EU agreement.

And I agree that the present arrangement is likely to stay, but likely is not the same as 100% certain. There is no obvious reason why people in Canada get reduced pensions but nevertheless they do.

JezR

In the past when reciprocal social security arrangements have been ended, such as with Australia, it hasn't been backdated in the sense that the entitlement under the agreement has been recognised up to the termination date and not removed. So the 30 years in the UK already accrued would still count towards any minimum number of contribution for an Irish pension. Under current policy UK pension in the absence of agreement would be frozen if she moved to Ireland.

Of course a new bilateral or EU arrangement may or may not be concluded.

Malthusian

SkyeKnight wrote: »

And I agree that the present arrangement is likely to stay, but likely is not the same as 100% certain. There is no obvious reason why people in Canada get reduced pensions but nevertheless they do.

Because Canada hasn't undertaken to pay inflation-linked increases to Canadian pensioners who move to Britain in order to save us paying them Pension Credit and other means-tested benefits, therefore we don't pay inflation-linked increases to British pensioners who move to Canada to save the Canadian welfare budget. If they become destitute in Canada that's Canada's problem, just as Canadians who become destitute in the UK is our problem.

There's nothing stopping us reaching such an agreement with Canada as we have with EU countries and various other countries around the world, but we haven't as yet.

Inflation-linked increases are a completely different kettle of fish from cancelling Irish people's State Pension entirely because they're living in the UK.

It is extremely unlikely that the Irish would impose such a penal restriction of movement on its citizens, not least because it would have to come up with a policy to house all the thousands of Irish citizens who flooded back into Ireland.

mania112

I don't think Brexit will happen in any case.

labrit

Hi,

Thanks for the reply; much appreciated.

I suspect it'll be a bilateral agreement with Ireland and the UK as my Irish friend has told me that we do have specific arrangements between our two countries that we don't have with any other EU countries.

Regards,