Appealing a termination of contract

NicolaElize

Hi everyone, I'll try and keep it as short as possible but my main question is, should my partner even bother appealing his termation of contract.

So basically my partner had a permanent full time contract in a shop, a family owned chain of about 4 shops so not a great big company. He's worked there for 10 months and last week he was taken into the office mid-shift with no warning, suspended in the presence of their in house HR person and when he asked what he was supposed to have done they wouldn't tell him what the incident was as it was confidential but said it was violent behaviour, and told go home and wait for a letter, his boss (the owners son) told him he was sorry it ended like this and that he'd already sought legal advise and "was doing everything by the book and that to appeal this would cost £1500 so not to bother".

When he got home I was confused as his boss sounded like he'd concluded already that he was losing his job without any kind of hearing or chance to even know what he was supposed to have done never mind give his side of the story. 4 days later he got a letter saying basically his contract had been terminated as they had footage of him attempting to throw a chair on cctv and they had no mitigating evidence so they have no choice but to terminate his contract to protect the other staff. Also mentioned other things like being on phone on shop floor and not completing tasks properly but there has been no kind of disciplinary or formal warnings etc.

My other half obviously denies this wholly although he did have a very brief two way argument with another member of staff away from the shop floor on the day in question, but the argument was started by the other person and was a few sentences exchanged, but definitely not physical and no chairs thrown.

It is worth noting that around 6 weeks ago there was an issue with something that was ordered incorrectly and his boss tried to get him to pay for the mistake out of his own pocket as he had successfully forced other staff to dobefore, however when he refused his boss banned him from selling high end items and basically was being really awful and rude towards him etc, my other half told me he knew he was going to try to get rid of him so this hasn't come as a big surprise at all.

He was never given an opportunity for a hearing to present his side of the story or any evidence he had, just suspended and then received a letter of termination.

I have said to him that he should appeal as if he hasn't done what they have said then why should be just roll over and be branded a violent employee but he doesn't want the hassle. I am happy to write the letter on his behalf and he isn't in a union or anything.

My question is if we appeal, what might happen? Is it worth it in the end? I am no expert and have read that there's no real employment rights until you've worked for an employer for two years. I want him to fight but obviously I can't make him.

Any advice welcome, thanks for reading I know it's been a bit of an essay!

martinsurrey

Unless you believe he has been sacked for a protected characteristic (race, gender, disability etc...) then there is no point in doing anything as they can sack him without reason as he has under 2 years service.

Make sure he gets his statutory rights to notice period and pay, and move on.

Guest101

NicolaElize wrote: »

Hi everyone, I'll try and keep it as short as possible but my main question is, should my partner even bother appealing his termation of contract.

So basically my partner had a permanent full time contract in a shop, a family owned chain of about 4 shops so not a great big company. He's worked there for 10 months and last week he was taken into the office mid-shift with no warning, suspended in the presence of their in house HR person and when he asked what he was supposed to have done they wouldn't tell him what the incident was as it was confidential but said it was violent behaviour, and told go home and wait for a letter, his boss (the owners son) told him he was sorry it ended like this and that he'd already sought legal advise and "was doing everything by the book and that to appeal this would cost £1500 so not to bother".

When he got home I was confused as his boss sounded like he'd concluded already that he was losing his job without any kind of hearing or chance to even know what he was supposed to have done never mind give his side of the story. 4 days later he got a letter saying basically his contract had been terminated as they had footage of him attempting to throw a chair on cctv and they had no mitigating evidence so they have no choice but to terminate his contract to protect the other staff. Also mentioned other things like being on phone on shop floor and not completing tasks properly but there has been no kind of disciplinary or formal warnings etc.

My other half obviously denies this wholly although he did have a very brief two way argument with another member of staff away from the shop floor on the day in question, but the argument was started by the other person and was a few sentences exchanged, but definitely not physical and no chairs thrown.

It is worth noting that around 6 weeks ago there was an issue with something that was ordered incorrectly and his boss tried to get him to pay for the mistake out of his own pocket as he had successfully forced other staff to dobefore, however when he refused his boss banned him from selling high end items and basically was being really awful and rude towards him etc, my other half told me he knew he was going to try to get rid of him so this hasn't come as a big surprise at all.

He was never given an opportunity for a hearing to present his side of the story or any evidence he had, just suspended and then received a letter of termination.

I have said to him that he should appeal as if he hasn't done what they have said then why should be just roll over and be branded a violent employee but he doesn't want the hassle. I am happy to write the letter on his behalf and he isn't in a union or anything.

My question is if we appeal, what might happen? Is it worth it in the end? I am no expert and have read that there's no real employment rights until you've worked for an employer for two years. I want him to fight but obviously I can't make him.

Any advice welcome, thanks for reading I know it's been a bit of an essay!

He's been there under 2 years, he can be dismissed for any reason.

agrinnall

The boss has got confused, I suspect he's referring to the cost of taking a case to an Employment Tribunal, but it doesn't sound like it would even be possible in this case as he's been there less than 2 years and it doesn't sound like protected discrimination is a factor. His only hope is to use whatever internal grievance procedure the company has, but I wouldn't get your hopes up, looking for another job is my best suggestion.

NicolaElize

agrinnall wrote: »

The boss has got confused, I suspect he's referring to the cost of taking a case to an Employment Tribunal, but it doesn't sound like it would even be possible in this case as he's been there less than 2 years and it doesn't sound like protected discrimination is a factor. His only hope is to use whatever internal grievance procedure the company has, but I wouldn't get your hopes up, looking for another job is my best suggestion.

Yes I agree with that, I looked at the costs of a tribunal and came to that conclusion also but included it in my post as it just shows how much cr*p is coming out his bosses mouth.

Thank you so much for all of your replies.
My other half doesn't really want to appeal so I'll leave him alone now. Thanks again everyone it's really appreciated! X

Guest101

You don't seem to understand though, so for future reference.


If under 2 years employment, you cannot appeal it in any meaningful way - unless the dismissal is based upon a protected characteristic

NicolaElize

Oh I do understand that part of it, especially now the responses have affirmed what I thought to be the case from what I'd read online. If it was me I would appeal on the grounds of simply wanting to clear my name as he's been sacked for something he's not done, especially since his boss doesn't have a clue, but he seems happy just being done with it all.

Thanks again! X

Guest101

NicolaElize wrote: »

Oh I do understand that part of it, especially now the responses have affirmed what I thought to be the case from what I'd read online. If it was me I would appeal on the grounds of simply wanting to clear my name as he's been sacked for something he's not done, especially since his boss doesn't have a clue, but he seems happy just being done with it all.

Thanks again! X

Appeal to who? The boss? Hardly going to go back on it?


Employment tribunal? You'd lose.


Anyway it's academic, as you / he isn't going to try fight it.


In his shoe's I'd be asking the boss for a reference to go quietly (and hope the boss doesn't realise that he's firmly in control)

NicolaElize

Guest101 wrote: »

Appeal to who? The boss? Hardly going to go back on it?


Employment tribunal? You'd lose.


Anyway it's academic, as you / he isn't going to try fight it.


In his shoe's I'd be asking the boss for a reference to go quietly (and hope the boss doesn't realise that he's firmly in control)

Yes, appeal via the company's appeal procedure.
I understand if he can just dismiss him anyway then it's a waste of time but surely they can't go around claiming to have cctv a violent attack when they don't. Isn't that like defamation of character or something?

Obviously I'm not an expert hence why I'm reaching out on here.

beckysbobbles1

Guest101 wrote: »

You don't seem to understand though, so for future reference.


If under 2 years employment, you cannot appeal it in any meaningful way - unless the dismissal is based upon a protected characteristic

When did this change? I ask because in 2013 I took an employer to tribunal for bullying after I left the job. I agreed to a pay out outside of the court.


I had only been an employee for 9 months.

Guest101

NicolaElize wrote: »

Yes, appeal via the company's appeal procedure.
I understand if he can just dismiss him anyway then it's a waste of time but surely they can't go around claiming to have cctv a violent attack when they don't. Isn't that like defamation of character or something?

Obviously I'm not an expert hence why I'm reaching out on here.

No probs.


Defamation of character comes under libel / slander.


However defamation of character requires a number of components.


1: A loss. - So for example if a colleague had claimed such an incident (falsely, so no cctv) and he was sacked. He could have a case against that colleague. But in this case the 'defamation' isn't related to the loss of employment, it's alongside it.
2: There needs to be an actual defamation in the eyes of a 3rd party. So if they were to put that in the reference, and it was wholly untrue, he could sue them (in theory)
3: Such cases require money, a lot of money. And even if he wins, he may not get costs.


The point is though, the boss isn't going around claiming to have such footage, he has said it to your partner. You can be defamed in your own eyes. There is no loss at the moment.


You're absolutely right though, the boss cant go around claiming such a thing, so if he does, then you need to decide if it's worth pursuing.