Tfl Penalty Fare for child13

gojumpinalake

I am seriously shocked. I have 2 sons aged just 11 and just 13. Live in london. They both have zip cards.
My 13 year old lost his zip, i have reordered. Travels to school on his own. I take 11 year old to school.
13 year old borrowed his 11 year olds zip-HE DID NOT KNOW HE WAS NOT MEANT TO DO THIS. Got on his bus to school.
An inspector checked his zip, confiscated his brothers card, gave him a temp travel card.
Gave him a printed pamphlet about Penalty Fare Notice fines, payment etc with a random handwritten number on the top.
Not a Penalty Fare Notice. Nothing official looking.
Son very scared, intimidated, innocent 13 year old. Thought he might being arrested, very upset when arrived home.
He does not know if it is a fine, does not know what the handwritten number means.

This is shocking. This is criminalising young children. Children of this age lose things all the time, to punish them in this way is tantamount to abuse. If this is a Penalty Fare it has been charged against a child who does not have to pay for bus travel anyway.

Now i have to replace a second card.
Surely a warning would suffice in a situation like this.

Anyone got any suggestions?

Thanks in advance.

shaun_from_Africa

gojumpinalake wrote: »

13 year old borrowed his 11 year olds zip-HE DID NOT KNOW HE WAS NOT MEANT TO DO THIS.

Surely the presence of the photograph of the holder on the card would make it clear enough that it was intended for use only by the person it was issued to.

peachyprice

gojumpinalake wrote: »

Anyone got any suggestions?

Yes, read the info that came with the cards. It states very clearly that they are NOT transferable, that is why they have a photo on.

Stigy

If he wasn't given anything official (which a pamphlet is NOT) then your son was not given a penalty fare. Your son wasn't being criminalised, quite clearly, but I'm surprised his details weren't at least taken as TfL still had a duty of care over him. It wasn't wrong for the inspector to take the card as it was clearly not his, however I'd have b been inclined to transfer said duty of care to you as his parent, and had you come and collect him.

I've done it before and am usually shocked by the attitude of parents' in such situation, some with the attitude often worse than their child's. What staff fail to realise in a lot of situations is that they have a duty of care to those under 16-years of age, and even issuing something like an Unpaid Fare Notice to complete their journey isn't really adhering to their safeguarding responsibility, as what happens when the staff member disappear? What if something then happens to the child whilst still on the public transport?

You're not going to like this next part, but I'll crack on anyway....I'm afraid you have to take some responsibility as the responsible adult. The staff here didn't know your son and presumably didn't know whether the card was stolen or not, hence why they seized it. Should they have delved deeper? Of course. Did they act unlawfully? Not judging by the info you have supplied, directly relating to the ticket (they gave your son a temporary pass, after all).

On a sidenote, you should still be able to get the zip card back. Just ordering a replacement might prove problematic as they're registered and questions may be asked as to why the need for two knew ones.

tykesi

gojumpinalake wrote: »

This is shocking. This is criminalising young children. Children of this age lose things all the time, to punish them in this way is tantamount to abuse. If this is a Penalty Fare it has been charged against a child who does not have to pay for bus travel anyway.

I think someone needs to get a grip and take some responsibility. Maybe you should have read the conditions on the use of the passes and educated your children in their correct use?

As usual though, it's always someone else's fault and they're the victim. You should definitely sue TFL, they must owe you billions in compensation ££££

Guest101

gojumpinalake wrote: »

I am seriously shocked. I have 2 sons aged just 11 and just 13. Live in london. They both have zip cards.
My 13 year old lost his zip, i have reordered. Travels to school on his own. I take 11 year old to school.
13 year old borrowed his 11 year olds zip-HE DID NOT KNOW HE WAS NOT MEANT TO DO THIS. Got on his bus to school.
An inspector checked his zip, confiscated his brothers card, gave him a temp travel card.
Gave him a printed pamphlet about Penalty Fare Notice fines, payment etc with a random handwritten number on the top.
Not a Penalty Fare Notice. Nothing official looking.
Son very scared, intimidated, innocent 13 year old. Thought he might being arrested, very upset when arrived home.
He does not know if it is a fine, does not know what the handwritten number means.

This is shocking. This is criminalising young children. Children of this age lose things all the time, to punish them in this way is tantamount to abuse. If this is a Penalty Fare it has been charged against a child who does not have to pay for bus travel anyway.

Now i have to replace a second card.
Surely a warning would suffice in a situation like this.

Anyone got any suggestions?

Thanks in advance.

A number of suggestions:


1: Teach your children about how the law works and what to do in these situations
2: No a warning would not suffice
3: Well if he gave his name and address then a penalty notice will be in the post no doubt (correctly issued by all accounts)