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Can an employer demand an employee pays for an error or is it illegal?

NicolaElize
Posts: 32 Forumite
Hi everyone
My other half works for a family run jewellers in a large shopping centre and they have a few shops. The owners are the parents of the management in his shop and HR is one girl who works in the shop too. Basically there's been a mistake and the wrong item has been ordered, the mistake was 50% bosses for writing the wrong number and price on the card given to the client but 50% his for not double checking when the client came back to finalise the sale. Anyway his boss has come to him and demanded he pay for the incorrectly ordered item out of his own pocket, when my other half refused be then questioned what he spends his money on if he didn't have the £200 to pay for the item, then he said they would go halves then said he should pay for it and he could have the money when and if it sold to someone else.
My question is is can he do his? He's approached him again today and has said if he doesn't pay for it he won't be allowed to sell large ticket items anymore as he cant "trust him" which means he'll have no chance of ever making comission. It is obviously nonsense. Can he do this? I just want something I can pass onto my other half to say to his boss if anyone knows the law on this or has any advice it would be much appreciated.
It's difficult as its a small company there's no running to HR to get help as that would simply cause problems and make him very unpopular.
Thanks in advance!
My other half works for a family run jewellers in a large shopping centre and they have a few shops. The owners are the parents of the management in his shop and HR is one girl who works in the shop too. Basically there's been a mistake and the wrong item has been ordered, the mistake was 50% bosses for writing the wrong number and price on the card given to the client but 50% his for not double checking when the client came back to finalise the sale. Anyway his boss has come to him and demanded he pay for the incorrectly ordered item out of his own pocket, when my other half refused be then questioned what he spends his money on if he didn't have the £200 to pay for the item, then he said they would go halves then said he should pay for it and he could have the money when and if it sold to someone else.
My question is is can he do his? He's approached him again today and has said if he doesn't pay for it he won't be allowed to sell large ticket items anymore as he cant "trust him" which means he'll have no chance of ever making comission. It is obviously nonsense. Can he do this? I just want something I can pass onto my other half to say to his boss if anyone knows the law on this or has any advice it would be much appreciated.
It's difficult as its a small company there's no running to HR to get help as that would simply cause problems and make him very unpopular.
Thanks in advance!
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Comments
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No, it is not legal. I believe that the Law changed back in the mid 1990's to make it illegal for employers to make up shortfalls in tills etc from employees.
Tell your oh not to pay and if they try to deduct it from his wages, he has the option of reclaiming the deduction via the Small Claims Court.Never Knowingly Understood.
Member #1 of £1,000 challenge - £13.74/ £1000 (that's 1.374%)
3-6 month EF £0/£3600 (that's 0 days worth)0 -
I'm not absolutely sure, may depend somewhat on the wording of the individual employment contract, but what it cannot do is push him below NMW, if that helps.
But in reality, boss has shown herself up to be 1) imprecise and incapable 2) shirking responsibility 3) vindictive and 4) not worth working for. Start looking for another job immediately, this one has no future.0 -
NicolaElize wrote: »My question is is can he do his? He's approached him again today and has said if he doesn't pay for it he won't be allowed to sell large ticket items anymore as he cant "trust him" which means he'll have no chance of ever making comission. It is obviously nonsense. Can he do this? I just want something I can pass onto my other half to say to his boss if anyone knows the law on this or has any advice it would be much appreciated.
I imagine this is calling for a frank discussion with the boss.
If the problem is 50% of each other's, and if the boss has offered to go halves on it, then I would try and turn this back on the employer. I would basically say something along the lines of:
- root cause of error was by manager pricing it incorrectly. You are not a mind reader so can't be expected to query every large price on the off chance that the manager priced it wrong.
- Accept that this should not happen again for the purpose of the company and offer to help with a review of the current pricings to see if there are any other discrepancies which can be fixed.
I would say consider paying half just to keep him sweet, but that opens you up to a possible similar situation in the future (and he might revoke the large ticket sales anyway even if you do pay!).
I think this is more a time where you have to be firm and fair, making it clear that you won't pay and (unfortunately) taking a reduction in commission in your stride until you find a better job.
That's my 2 cents. I just can't see how you could pay and not compromise yourself in the future.
Whether or not it is illegal, I would assume that it is legal in the sense that he can take you to small claims court and either win or lose! But I'm not sure if a deduction from your wages could be made.0 -
Completely agree with Daytona - your o/h pays half and this makes it easier for the boss to do it again, and still may remove the option of selling big ticket items.0
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I would ask why he wastes his money employing a manager if he expects those on the floor to pay out every time the manager makes a mistake.
Whats the point in having management if they are not doing what they are paid to do, manage things.
Make it clear no you will not be paying for managements incompetence.I do Contracts, all day every day.0 -
No, it is not legal. I believe that the Law changed back in the mid 1990's to make it illegal for employers to make up shortfalls in tills etc from employees.
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Not exactly it didn't. It is lawful in retail to make deductions from wages for shortfalls provided it is clearly identifiable who was responsible for the shortfall, and the deduction is not more than 10% of the wage - which, incidentally, does permit the wage paid to fall below the minimum wage, because the deduction is made AFTER the calculation of the minimum wage 'living wage due.
But in fact, this misses the point. The employer isn't threatening to deduct anything. They are threatening to refuse to allow the employee to sell expensive items, where commission is made. They can decide to do that, and it is perfectly lawful. They can decide who is and isn't allowed to sell something whenever they want.0 -
What exactly is the £200? Is this the retail price of the wrongly ordered item or what the jeweller paid for it? Could the loss be reduced by returning it and maybe paying the supplier a restocking fee? Could it be sold more rapidly by offering it at a considerable discount? If your OH paid the full £200 would the item then be his? Would any profit when it was sold also be his?But a banker, engaged at enormous expense,Had the whole of their cash in his care.
Lewis Carroll0
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