Any advice? Pension scheme claiming 12 years contributions/interest though opted out?

bigadaj

The problem is that the people who have responded have some idea of what you have given up, and what you could potentially gain, you apparently don't seem to realise that.

Let's take some emotion out of this and just look at the numbers.

If you wanted to post what your backup dated contributions would be and the pension you would gain then there would be some objective opinion.

As the others have said ten value of the benefits would be many times what they are asking you to contribute. Let's assume they are asking for £40k now, and this would buy you a £10k per year pension. An open market annuity for that sum, approximate because it depends on whether and how much it is inflation linked, lump sum, spouse benefits etc, could be bought at a cost of say £300k.

So you put in £40k and you get £300k back, alternatively the lump sum you contribute would be paid back in less than four years, so you now see why you have had the responses you've had?

It would be an option for you to opt in, raise the lump sum by say a mortgage or loan, and be many times better off with the interest you would have to pay on the loan.

As a taxpayer then I'd encourage you to refuse to engage and turn down their suggestions, but it's up to you.

dunstonh

QUESTIONS
If you have never paid any contributions (for 13 years) then elect to what you believe is opting back into a scheme (you believe you opted out of) is it legal for the pension company to then demand 10 years 3 months of 'backdated' contributions from both you and your employer?

They are not demanding it. They are giving you a wonderful opportunity to get those missing years back. If you refuse this option, then they will make the necessary adjustments to show you were not a member.

Is not the fact that no pension contributions were made by my Employer nor deducted from my salary- for 13 years- clear evidence that I did not want to participate in a pension scheme. No annual statements/ no deductions appearing in my monthly salary slip?

It is not clear evidence of any train of thought. Some people have paid PPI for decades but claim they never knew they paid it. Some people never look at their payslips. A number havent got a clue what a payslip tells them apart from one figure. No assumptions can be made from this.

Is not the fact that I contacted both HR and the pension managers in 2008- clearly stating that I had opted out in 2002- further proof of this earlier opt out?

Who cares what you did then. You now have this chance to correct a really bad decision you made.

Also- in October 2008- should not either/ both the pension managers or my employers HR not flagged up the fact that- at that time they had no information on me so if I believed I had opted out I needed to compete a specific form (or provide one)? Neither of them provided me this information October 2008- and at worst I would have been in the same situation I am now but only 8 years earlier/ with far less to pay...

It would have been nice and it may well be one of the contributory reasons why they are now offering you this wonderful opportunity.

If there is a liability is it not the University who should pay for the error that TPS claim has taken place?

An error does not give you legal entitlement. Plus, you have contradicted yourself suggesting you knew you were not opted in.

It's so frustrating! All I wanted was to opt back into the TPS and get 17 years of contributions in before I retired.

But so good a the same time as they are giving you the chance to get 27 years. How excellent is that?

kidmugsy

rjs200 wrote: »

All you are doing in your posts is making judgemental comments on my decisions!

It's customary to try to look after children and the childish, even if they stamp their little feet and shriek.

hyubh

rjs200 wrote: »

All you are doing in your posts is making judgemental comments on my decisions!

I suggest you reread my response if you seriously think that is 'all' I have done. Key points included:

- The fact the LGPS and TPS are different schemes, and the implications of this.
- The fact it appears your HR department both failed in their employer responsibilities to the TPS then compounded this failure by misadvising you.
- The fact your claims of maladministration on TP's part are however based on wrong assumptions, e.g on the implications of a lack of contribution data.
- The fact LGPS and/or TPS membership is highly valuable.
- The suggestion of asking for a reasonable repayment plan from TP.

On the other thread kidmugsy has then made the added, better suggestion of asking your employer for free loan to repay TP, given it was they who messed up.

TPS dont care about pre 2005 so the LGPS is erroneous other than it was the only time myself and University HR had any communication about pensions oprior to 2002. They knew I had opted out of that scheme.

You had opted out of the LGPS only. TP would neither have known nor cared - ditto if the situation was the other way round.

TPS claim I should have been autoenrolled by the universty.

They are correct.

Had that been the case then deductions would have been made.

Your employer messed up.

So I have no idea at all why TPS expect me to pay backdated contributions to a scheme I was never a member of and not enrolled into- and therefore could not opt out of.

The issue is you WERE a member of the scheme, and TP are now chasing the missing contributions on behalf of the DfE. Please understand this point.

If you are seriously looking into making a formal complaint, ask HR about their IDRP for pensions and make the complaint focussed on them, not TP. I also still highly recommend using this as an opportunity to claim back the missing TPS membership, rather than being focussed on a capital sum that you will not be expected to pay off in one go from your own resources anyhow.

mgdavid

If your dealings with HR and the Pensions people have been with the same attitude you've shown on this thread then I am sorry to say you may struggle to get what you regard as a satisfactory conclusion.
You sound a bit too confrontational - whereas what is needed is to work in a co-operative way to find a solution that is at least palatable to all parties.

AnotherJoe

dunstonh wrote: »

They are not demanding it. They are giving you a wonderful opportunity to get those missing years back.

My impression is that they clearly are demanding it and won't let the OP start now as if he just started his job this week.

hyubh

AnotherJoe wrote: »

My impression is that they clearly are demanding it and won't let the OP start now as if he just started his job this week.

Right. The fact contributions were not paid is not - in the context of scheme auto-enrolment rules - sufficient evidence of having opted out. From TP's point of view the OP was in the scheme on starting the permanent teaching post, and they are now claiming the missing employer and employee contributions.

There's a thin chance suitable evidence to the contrary can be 'found', though (in my view) it would be a waste of the OP's time to pursue this, especially given the high value of the pension that would be gained. Better accept TP's position and instead direct the emotion expressed in this thread on getting the employer to materially help correct their own mistakes.

(Would be handy not to have two threads by the way, as slightly different, though complementary, points are being made to the OP in each!)