Funding Cuts and Usage Decline....Which Comes First?

Loanranger

My local library was great, we used it frequently and borrowed the max number of books. Then it closed for several months for a refurb. Nothing wrong with it, IMHO but there you go. This was about 5 years ago.
So, deprived of our local source of free reading we used two other libraries, one larger the other smaller than the original one we frequented, all within probably 2 to three miles but didn't like them nearly so much as the original which closed for about six months.
In the end we bought Kindles and have not visited a library since.
I know the value of libraries and of online reference resources. I used to have access as a staff member to a major university library and used it to borrow and to look up stuff online.
As for people wanting to use the place instead of buying an overpriced coffee, I wonder why local authority offices with large reception areas are not set up to offer online access to everyone including the homeless.

vivatifosi

Loanranger wrote: »

Surely not thousands of years, Viva??

Well, the Library at Alexandria was build about 235 BCE and destroyed in 391CE, so it was old and established even at the time of its destruction. The book of Kells is over 1200 years old, hence my comment (not that you could borrow that as an inter-library loan). More realistically it is hundreds or a hundred or so years in both cases, however both libraries and books are over 1000 years old.

The first libraries in the UK were probably in the 1600s, though the first public library as you would know it today was about 150-160 years ago. (ETA I stand corrected, Oxford Uni says that it had its first pre-Bodleian Library in approx 1320).

I was purely trying to get the point across that ebook offerings will take a bit of time to get right as they are very much the new kid on the block.

Another ETA (sorry)... I have beeen reading up on the history of libraries, fascinating! Who knew that the first ones were built 5000 years ago, or that the Library at Alexandria set out to hold 500,000 texts? OK, so the answer is probably Antrobus, but fascinating nevertheless:
http://www.history-magazine.com/libraries.html

[Deleted User]

There was a similar discussion to this a few months ago I think, but folk who haven't been to a library for a while might be surprised what they offer - I posted this on the other thread, but here is the list of activities in one of the Edinburgh ones -

"Free wifi
Self service
Disabled access
Library Link
Community room for hire (see below)
Toilets
Toilets for disabled users
Baby changing facilities
X-box, Wii and Playstation gaming consoles
Photocopier, printer and scanner
Fax
Cafe area with hot drinks machine
Plasma screen
Bookable gallery area - ask staff for details
Hosuebound rounds
Bookbug Sessions A free event for 0 to 4 year olds and their parents/carers. Every Wednesday from 10.15am or 11.15 - this is very popular, please come early to either session.
(During school holiday periods there will be one rhymetime starting at 10.30am)
Weekend sessions take place every Saturday morning at 11.30
Spanish language rhymetime, last Tuesday of the month, 10.30 - 11.15am
Book groups First Tuesday of every month from 6.30-7.30pm.
Teen book group meets on the last Thursday of every month, 3.45 - 4.45pm
Other events Chatterbooks for ages 8 - 12: talking about the books you want to read. Meets every third Saturday from 2.00 - 3.00pm

Friday Craft (suitable for 6-12 year olds), every Friday at 2pm

Storytime (suitable for 3-6 years) Tuesdays during term time at 4pm

Writers Group, meets on the second Monday of the Month, ask staff for details

Councillors' surgeries

Regular art and colouring competitions for children
(At all events children under 8 years old must be accompanied by a parent/carer over 12)
Room hire Commercial:
3 hour block: £53

Non commercial:
3 hour block: £20.50

Rates for lets outside opening hours by negotiation."

Plenty going on there. Not bad, I think.

WR

zagubov

When I first came to London, you could pop into our local library (The Tate) and see a book group that P L Travers would attend.

As a kid, my library was a source of books and records I'd never be able to buy. Decades later I started teaching in night school and day-release courses for full-time workers, and feel this is now a neglected priority whose diminution brings shame to our society.

I know these millionaire philanthropists like Carnegie got a bad press for their Social Darwinist ideas but their great contribution to society was the way they promoted self-improvement by education and libraries.

Loads of people mourn the vandalism of the bulk erasing of British TV's cultural output in the 60s and 70s (well I mourn it). How much worse this intellectual vandalism is by comparison.

Generali

zagubov wrote: »

When I first came to London, you could pop into our local library (The Tate) and see a book group that P L Travers would attend.

As a kid, my library was a source of books and records I'd never be able to buy. Decades later I started teaching in night school and day-release courses for full-time workers, and feel this is now a neglected priority whose diminution brings shame to our society.

I know these millionaire philanthropists like Carnegie got a bad press for their Social Darwinist ideas but their great contribution to society was the way they promoted self-improvement by education and libraries.

Loads of people mourn the vandalism of the bulk erasing of British TV's cultural output in the 60s and 70s (well I mourn it). How much worse this intellectual vandalism is by comparison.

Is this cultural vandalism or the culture simply changing? There's no point in having a load of empty libraries any more than there would be having a bunch of empty amphitheaters offering satyrs or paying writers to produce unread epics.

Surely culture is the stuff that we do together. If that is sitting and watching Eastenders and Match of the Day then so be it.

vivatifosi

Generali wrote: »

Is this cultural vandalism or the culture simply changing? There's no point in having a load of empty libraries any more than there would be having a bunch of empty amphitheaters offering satyrs or paying writers to produce unread epics.

Surely culture is the stuff that we do together. If that is sitting and watching Eastenders and Match of the Day then so be it.

The challenge is keeping the library relevant for the specific community it represents. That's why the answer can't be the same everywhere.

Of course libraries need to cut their cloth appropriately. But we should not lose sight of the fact that if you think of great civilisations... the Greeks, Egyptians, the Mesopotamians, Italy in the Renaissance, all of modern Europe, Russia, China... all have libraries.

If you cut them out, got rid of public libraries altogether, all you would save is 1% of the local government budget. Is that a saving too many?

Mistermeaner

vivatifosi wrote: »

The challenge is keeping the library relevant for the specific community it represents. That's why the answer can't be the same everywhere.

Of course libraries need to cut their cloth appropriately. But we should not lose sight of the fact that if you think of great civilisations... the Greeks, Egyptians, the Mesopotamians, Italy in the Renaissance, all of modern Europe, Russia, China... all have libraries.

If you cut them out, got rid of public libraries altogether, all you would save is 1% of the local government budget. Is that a saving too many?

No. And find a few more things like libraries that serve little value to the majority of people and maybe council tax bills and central funding can be reduced a little then people can make their own decisions a out how their money is spent.

vivatifosi

Mistermeaner wrote: »

No. And find a few more things like libraries that serve little value to the majority of people and maybe council tax bills and central funding can be reduced a little then people can make their own decisions a out how their money is spent.

I note that you have a football as your avatar. By your argument, should all public sports greens and football pitches be closed because the majority do not use them?

Mistermeaner

That's a default avatar!

For what its worth I think some natural green space should be preserved for those who wish to make use of it, but I'm not a fan of man made gravel paths and fencing being erected all over it.

Sports clubs should imo be run along trust non profit lines but paid for by those who use them

Just in same way I don't think councils should provide gyms that are free to a limited few, and subscription to the many at costs that are higher than the already existing local private gyms (recent local experience) they are essentially competing with existing private industry on an unfair footing and doing it very badly.

lawriejones1

For my family libraries were at the heart of the Conservative ideals of self-improvement. They were incredible places to read and learn, helping my dad to get a scholarship to Oxford. Without a library he'd have never had the access to knowledge. When he started his own business it was an incredible source of knowledge and support to have all of those books there, and provided the theoretical basis and practical knowledge to grow a business to employing over 12 people in a deprived community.

It's true we can now afford to buy books and there's no local library for me, but they're still incredible places that should be at the heart of a community that wants to grow and develop.