Dentist £££

FBaby

heuchera wrote: »

Have you read the link?

I don't need to! I know from professional experience that no adult will get NHS braces for cosmetic reasons, end of.

I do agree with you that there is some level of interpretation of the criteria for children, however, whereas at the beginning I thought the second orthodontist had been lenient hence being entitled, when I realise the change in her speech afterwards (indeed, it was difficult to understand her before), I realised that the second orthodontist had actually applied the criteria properly and it was the first one who had not been thorough enough (maybe, maybe not related to the closure of the practice).

FBaby

So I did read the link and don't understand why you are confused as it is very clear!

Orthodontic treatment is only available at no cost on the NHS for young people under the age of 18.

So black and white, it is NOT available for adults

NHS orthodontic care is not usually available for adults, but may be approved on a case-by-case basis if needed for health reasons.

You will notice the reference to HEALTH reasons, ie. not cosmetic.

mal4mac

"Treatment is also available on the NHS at the standard charge for complex dental treatment (just under £219) for adults who need it. However, adults who want orthodontic treatment to fix minor cosmetic problems aren't eligible for NHS treatment."

http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/dentalhealth/Pages/braces.aspx

This means, adults who want orthodontic treatment to fix major cosmetic problems are eligible for NHS treatment.

If I had a major cosmetic problem then I'd try and get braces on the NHS by all means - it could save me £4000! (By all means, I mean pursuing health ombudsmen, MPs, local newspapers, etc,..)

If the official nhs link I listed is incorrect, then at least "pursuing all means" might get the page fixed and make everything a bit clearer for everyone.

brook2jack

Unfortunately many of the links about NHS dentistry are incorrect. Fbabys NHS link is correct in that most adults will not get NHS orthodontics and certainly not for cosmetic reasons , major or minor.

If you go to a dentist providing NHS treatment they have to obey the referral guidelines and if you read the links I posted you will see that only complex treatments for major health problems that include a surgical component will be accepted for NHS orthodontics.

If your dentists sends off a referral that does not meet that criteria it will just get sent back with a snotty letter telling them to read the criteria again.

If you doubt any of this ask your local ccg , lhb etc. Their policies are clear to see. Again I have posted some of these links and you can easily find them for your own area.

In an era when cancer treatments are rationed how can spending thousands of pounds on braces for adults be justified? Braces for children are being rationed more and more , in our area and many others they are investigating taking orthodontics for children entirely out of the NHS except for the same serious problems that qualify adults. However with a three year waiting list for initial appointments many would argue that orthodontics are gradually being removed from the NHS anyway.

The British Orthodontic site is back up again and is an excellent resource for all orthodontic questions . Here is the information on adult orthodontics. http://www.bos.org.uk/Public-Patients/Orthodontics-For-Adults/FAQ/Can-I-Have-Treatment-Within-The-NHS-as-an-Adult

heuchera

brook2jack wrote: »

In an era when cancer treatments are rationed how can spending thousands of pounds on braces for adults be justified? Braces for children are being rationed more and more , in our area and many others they are investigating taking orthodontics for children entirely out of the NHS except for the same serious problems that qualify adults. However with a three year waiting list for initial appointments many would argue that orthodontics are gradually being removed from the NHS anyway.

Which cancer treatments are rationed in favour of braces for adults?!

It's all very well implying that people who want braces are vain and unreasonable, but if you knew the effects that having seriously misaligned teeth can have on the individual's confidence and self esteem, even their career and earnings, you perhaps wouldn't be so dismissive.

Not everyone has thousands of pounds at their disposal to spend on private dentist fees. The NHS should (and does, according to the link) help people who have grade 3 or 4 problems or above.

Go by the official link, not by an anonymous internet person.
mal4mac, maybe let us know how you get on If the website's wrong they can at least correct it.

brook2jack

Read http://www.bos.org.uk/Public-Patients/Orthodontics-For-Adults/FAQ/Can-I-Have-Treatment-Within-The-NHS-as-an-Adult

There are no orthodontists with contracts to treat adults and hospitals will not accept orthodontic patients who do not have complex problems that require surgery.

http://www.bos.org.uk/Public-Patients/Orthodontics-For-Adults/FAQ/What-does-Orthodontic-Treatment-Cost

The public information on NHS dentistry is often very poor but here is the NHS choices link which says ortho for adults is generally not available. http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/orthodontics/pages/accessingorthodontics.aspx

I am implying nothing and it is not me who has made the decisions about adult orthodontics although when questioned the majority of the U.K. Public believes braces should not be funded by the NHS.

. However in my area lucentis ,a treatment which will save people's sight , is generally not available. The former head of NHS commissioning has moved to a different area as they have cancer which will not be treated in our area because the drugs are too expensive.

As a nation we know the NHS is cash constrained. As a result many treatments which used to be available on the NHS are no longer .

The simple answer is iotn is a tool to assess NHS treatment for under 18s only not adults http://www.bos.org.uk/Public-Patients/Orthodontics-for-children-teens/Fact-File-FAQ/What-Is-The-IOTN

There is no mechanism for an adult to be seen in general practice orthodontists as there are no contracts for adult treatment except in the hospital service , where criteria are strictly enforced ,see previous links , that only serious facial problems involving surgery as well as orthodontics will be treated. Indeed of the over 202,000 patients who started orthodontic treatment last year only around a thousand were adults.

heuchera

brook2jack wrote: »

I am implying nothing and it is not me who has made the decisions about adult orthodontics although when questioned the majority of the U.K. Public believes braces should not be funded by the NHS.

I understand it's not you making the decisions.

I'm not sure where the statistics come from for your assertion (Daily Mail perhaps?;)), but having seen in another great British tabloid that 99% of people want to being back hanging I wouldn't set too much store by what the UK public supposedly think.


I wish they'd ask people with a few braincells to fill these surveys out, lol

brook2jack

Actually it was research done by the university of Cardiff asking people to prioritise health spending.

To put this into context in the UK around 40% of the total bill for children's dentistry is spent on orthodontics. This is at a time when the number one reason for a child to need a hospital bed is because of dental decay.

This is a report from Wales but the problems are UK wide https://www2.nphs.wales.nhs.uk/CorporateServicesDocuments.nsf/cf3d6e123b990da080256fa300512475/c5db4910888a0f5480257cad00535b28/$FILE/Consultation Response - Orthodontic services in Wales.docx

We are spending money on straightening a few children's teeth when the majority of children in Wales, NI and Scotland (less in England) have decay by the time they are five.

Less than 50% of the population visit the dentist (70% of children) and dentistry has a fixed NHS budget. The result of consultation documents like this is it is increasingly difficult to justify spending money on braces when faced with an increasing amount of decay and disease ,resulting in hospital treatment, in children.

heuchera

But decay is preventable, misaligned teeth is not..
Seems very unfair.

brook2jack

Misaligned teeth are not life threatening.

54,000 children in England and Wales attended hospital for dental decay 2013 to 2014. Any general anaesthetic is potentially hazardous and obviously dental infection is potentially hazardous.

Does it still seem right that 40% of the children's dental budget is spent on orthodontics?

A simple course of orthodontics for an adult costs the NHS a minimum of £1300. To put that into context the local oral surgery department has a total annual budget of £35,000 to rebuild the faces and jaws of people who have had oral cancer. The upshot of this is that people wait months/years to have their faces rebuilt so they can eat,speak and look more normal.

Does it still seem a good idea for the NHS to provide braces for adults wonky teeth? It is this background that made the public ,who were asked , place orthodontics very low on spending priorities.