UKPC windscreen PCN for 'leaving site'

ratechaser

Afternoon all,

First post in this forum, and I hope you won't take offence when I say it's not something I hope to be doing too often! I have read the newbies thread in some detail (I hope) so please go easy on me...

Anyway, as the title says, a windscreen PCN was received yesterday, for parking in a leisure park that had no parking charges or time limit conditions, but did come with a warning (and there are lots of signs...) that a charge was payable if the driver left the 'site'. The PCN state's the 'time first seen' as about a minute after the car was parked, and the 'issue time' as 22 minutes later.

Leaving aside a total lack of clarity of what constituted the boundary of 'the site' (and I'm going back there soon to take some pictures), I'm very new to this, but from what I have been reading, it sounds like the keeper really ought to appeal rather than pay the generously reduced offer of £60 in the next 14 days.

The big fly in the ointment here is my DW, who is the car's registered keeper (but wasn't present) and whose view is that The driver is bang to rights here, should pay up ASAP, and will be giving me increasingly severe tinnitus for every single day that this remains unresolved. Given that the NTK will eventually be addressed to her, and the initial and POPLA appeals really have to be in her name, I can't imagine this will be easy on me...

So unless anyone can offer me some very clear reassurance that I've got 100% chance of successfully appealing, then I suspect that '£60' versus 'continued use of my ears' is not going to be a tough call. Although it makes my blood boil! :mad:

Anyway, rant over. If anyone can offer anything constructive, then do let me know!

thanks
RC

catfunt

The DW clearly does not have a clue.

These "leaving the site" notices are not obvious and what if you need to visit a cashpoint so that you can spend money on the outlets on site???

Have another read of the NEWBIES thread, and also do a search on this forum for "leaving site". You will get plenty of info and should get a good idea on what your next steps are.

And make sure that she knows that if you "pay as you are bang to rights" then she/you are simply funding a continuing scam.

Only one case of this nature has gone to court, and that ended badly for the PPC. Very badly.

Who was the PPC?

bod1467

catfunt wrote: »

Who was the PPC?

Read the thread title.

What is a DW? Dear Wife? Does this forum really have to descend into Mumsnet?

ratechaser

Yes, I read that particular case judgement, was thinking of sending it to the DW to highlight my point.

I have read the newbies thread honestly! It was UKPC per my thread title, so I know that as BPA members, it will be a POPLA appeal route, which is at least some help. The windscreen PCN does also appear to have the required information on it.

Anyway, just sitting in the car park now to get some photos of it comes to it. Honestly, if they put the signs 10 feet up a lamppost you'd think they might make the writing bigger than a 12 point font. That's problem 1. Problem 2 is no explicit signage stating that the footbridge leading from the car park across the railway line is the site boundary (and bear in mind that this is a 'leisure park' car park and the bridge leads to the 'leisure centre' so is it unreasonable to think it's all part of the same site...). Problem 3 is that given there are no charges or time limit stated for parking, how can there be any reasonable costs to recover here?

But I'm getting ahead of myself, plenty of reasons to think I'd win any appeal, but the DW is the bigger problem!

Redx

bod1467 wrote: »

What is a DW? Dear Wife? Does this forum really have to descend into Mumsnet?

I have no idea but that was my guess too, its usually OH though

The_Deep

Given the difficulty of proving a "leaving site" charge in court, the failure of the PW, (parking weasel), to mitigate his employer's loses, and UKPC's record of fraudulent behaviour, I would not be inclined to take this too seriously.

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]UKPC are former clampers who have been involved in quite a number of sordid scams, for example[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hull Trading Standards took them to court on 15 counts of fraud. UKPC won all but one, but only because they had a better lawyer, a Q.C. If I recall correctly[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=63597[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]They were bested by a Winchester barrister [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?377246-UKPC-liable-for-trespass-**SUCCESS**[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]They were involved in a large scale scam which resulted in a DVLA suspension[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/11858473/Parking-firm-UKPC-admits-faking-tickets-to-fine-drivers.html[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Then they had another go, this one is still being investigated[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5390608[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]And then of course there was Tracey Kiss[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://www.tracykiss.com/product-reviews/my-ukpc-parking-charge/[/FONT]

Coupon-mad

Given that the NTK will eventually be addressed to her,

No it won't because UKPC won't remember to send one. That's the reason why the NEWBIES FAQS thread tells the keeper to appeal at day 26 online. Makes them concentrate on the appeal and they forget they haven't send a NTK.

Then the keeper (your DW) wins at POPLA. With our help, with the first appeal point being 'no NTK' - keeper can't be held liable and the appellant is the keeper.

First appeal is already written for her by me in the NEWBIES thread and I'm also a wife and Mum, who would advise you to keep your money in your wallet.

ratechaser

Thanks The Deep, some interesting reading there.

Coupon-mad, thank you too, and yes, my plan is already mapped out in my head, it's just whether or not I get away with executing it. I think a long hard chat with the DW, OH or whatever is an acceptable acronym for Mrs RC is on this forum is in order here!

If anyone wants a free eye test, I'll post a picture of one of the high up signs when i work out how to get it into Dropbox...

Coupon-mad

You could always appeal in your name as the keeper of the vehicle so the rejection letter comes in your name and ultimately if you muck up, it will be your issue.

A 'keeper' is not necessarily the registered keeper. The keeper can be you. Just DO NOT mention who the driver was or you blow the winning appeal point and have to hope to win on another one!

ratechaser

Ah, there's an idea. At least it means I can contain it then!

catfunt

bod1467 wrote: »

Read the thread title.

:doh:sorry, half asleep!