DFW Debt_Denier

Debt_Denier

crazy_cat_lady wrote: »

As tallyhoh says - a spending diary will really highlight where the cash is going.
When I first started I was horrified how much I was spending (and wasting) on food and groceries. It's still my biggest weakness now although I can get by on less than £300 a month easily.
I have 2 kids that do 4 sports clubs between them at a total cost of £72 per month - I don't know if that's particularly cheap or yours are particularly expensive.

They play tennis and are both very good but it is an expensive habit but they love it. The kit is expensive as is the coaching. They also have swimming lessons and football coaching but that is a cheap after school club. The tennis is the big cost.

Debt_Denier

Monthly Income Details
Monthly income after tax................ 2067
Partners monthly income after tax....... 1843
Benefits................................ 137.6
Other income............................ 0
Total monthly income.................... 4047.6

Monthly Expense Details
Mortgage................................ 656.7
Secured/HP loan repayments.............. 0
Rent.................................... 0
Management charge (leasehold property).. 0
Council tax............................. 114 we pay x10 per year but this is 1/12
Electricity............................. 41 we pay combined so have just split a bit arbitrarily
Gas..................................... 50
Oil..................................... 0
Water rates............................. 51
Telephone (land line)................... 31.4 includes broadband - all family overseas so have to have landline
Mobile phone............................ 49.98 - 1 yr left on contracts
TV Licence.............................. 12.12
Satellite/Cable TV...................... 0
Internet Services....................... 0
Groceries etc. ......................... 375
Clothing................................ 140 - children grow so fast
Petrol/diesel........................... 130
Road tax................................ 0 - quite new efficient car
Car Insurance........................... 37.5
Car maintenance (including MOT)......... 25
Car parking............................. 0
Other travel............................ 0
Childcare/nursery....................... 100
Other child related expenses............ 144 - they play tennis which is expensive but they love it. They also have swim/football lessons but these are quite cheap
Medical (prescriptions, dentist etc).... 0
Pet insurance/vet bills................. 0
Buildings insurance..................... 17 - includes contents
Contents insurance...................... 0
Life assurance ......................... 22.88
Other insurance......................... 4 - annual family policy
Presents (birthday, christmas etc)...... 150 - including parties for my children, gifts for family/children's friends
Haircuts................................ 20
Entertainment........................... 100 - not really sure tried to tot it up in my head
Holiday................................. 250 - all family overseas so no other chance to see any relatives unless we go to them
Emergency fund.......................... 0
OH sport ............................... 24
gym..................................... 29 for me but i have looked around. 2 classes a week at local college would be at least £24 a month and I get free parking in town and free swimming (fun swimming) for the family in evenings. I also pay for lessons in a different pool
union and pol party..................... 24 - others have suggested I give this up but I can't. I have been made redundant before because I was pregnant. This is who I am
newspaper subs.......................... 5
netflix................................. 5.99
tutor for child#2....................... 80 second child has hearing problems not bad enough to qualify for help from scholl but does tend to get a bit lost without extra help
Total monthly expenses.................. 2689.57


Assets
Cash.................................... 0
House value (Gross)..................... 185000
Shares and bonds........................ 0
Car(s).................................. 8000
Other assets............................ 0
Total Assets............................ 193000


Secured & HP Debts
Description....................Debt......Monthly.. .APR
Mortgage...................... 98700....(656.7)....2.49
Total secured & HP debts...... 98700.....-.........-

Unsecured Debts
Description....................Debt......Monthly.. .APR
cc1............................705.......14....... .16.1
cc2............................266.......5........ .16.1
cc3............................2423......25....... .0
car loan.......................5267......232.5.....4.4
Total unsecured debts..........8661......276.5.....-


Monthly Budget Summary
Total monthly income.................... 4,047.6
Expenses (including HP & secured debts). 4,039.57
Available for debt repayments........... 8.03
Monthly UNsecured debt repayments....... 276.5
Amount left after debt repayments. 1,081.53

Personal Balance Sheet Summary
Total assets (things you own)........... 193,000
Total HP & Secured debt................. -98,700
Total Unsecured debt.................... -8,661
Net Assets.............................. 85,639

andyfromotley

I am not a huge fan of CC's for emergencies, You need an Emerency Fund for emergencies. About 1K is plenty. It means you can get rid of your cards, and when its your hard earned money you are much much less likely to dip into it. yes there are people who say ahhh but if you pay it off a card you are saving interest blah blah blah, The number who do so are far outnumbered by the number who rack up further debt on their 'emergency' card!

Oh your phone - you might be able to save money using an overide serveice such as 18185.

Debt_Denier

andyfromotley wrote: »

I am not a huge fan of CC's for emergencies, You need an Emerency Fund for emergencies. About 1K is plenty. It means you can get rid of your cards, and when its your hard earned money you are much much less likely to dip into it. yes there are people who say ahhh but if you pay it off a card you are saving interest blah blah blah, The number who do so are far outnumbered by the number who rack up further debt on their 'emergency' card!

Oh your phone - you might be able to save money using an overide serveice such as 18185.

Thanks for taking the time to reply. I am proud to report that we have chopped up all but one credit card. The thing I have realised in the last few weeks is that not only are we living month to month but we are living a fortnight ahead of our salary. I always thought that was okay but it really isn't. We told ourselves that our children were still young - at one stage practially every single penny I was earning was going on nursery and commuting costs. A big chunk of OHs salary was going on house repairs/renovations not I hasten to add fancy furniture or shiny new kitchen appliances but actual necessary things like damp proofing etc that we got use to simply having nothing to save. When we first moved in we spend the very last of our savings on a new boiler and then everything else was funded by CCs and loans it became a habit and now that the house is habitable and the nursery fees are gone we just got used to being in debt. We still don't have the fancy furniture etc but we did get in the habit of "cheap" but frequent visits home/holidays so that the children didn't miss out on family.

I am really determined to get rid of the debt and the mindset that got us into this and at the same time to build up a buffer for us so it doesn't happen again.

AnotherJoe

Are you seriously spending £150 a month on presents ? Wow. Probably as much as your new boiler. ........... Every year.

Debt_Denier

AnotherJoe wrote: »

Are you seriously spending £150 a month on presents ? Wow. Probably as much as your new boiler. ........... Every year.

I would love to know what other parents/aunts uncles etc do?
I don't really know to be honest and really add it up. 12 times 150 is £1800. Is that really that unrealistic?
Usually I just add this sort of thing into my shopping trolley and not think about it.
Let's see we go to parties of children at school at least 1 per month I have 2 children (so one of them them has a party at least every other month) at e.g £10 per party so = £120 per year. , We have a party for each of our children and even if you just take 6 boys for a game of bowling and a mcdonalds it adds up - certainly no change from £150 so = £300 per year,
We buy them something small I always say I think the party is the present but let's say £40 each = £80
then we have Christmas where I tend to spend about £200 per child = £400,
presents for nieces and nephews overseas - I am careful and I buy small items but the postage adds up I would say at least £15 per child per year and we have 10 nieces and nephews all under 10. I will stop when they get older but = £150
plus a little something each at Christmas = £75 I mean really little
I don't buy for my sisters, brothers etc but my parents e.g for birthday's, mother's day, fathers day = £80
Presents for each other OH and me. We only do this at Christmas for the sake of the children seeing that we buy for each other no more than £20 each for b'day, anniversary, Christmas = £120
Then we have bits and pieces people at work going on maternity leave, teachers at school, the bus drive, dinner ladies etc at least £60 per year = £1385
Then the odd wedding, christening etc...thankfully we are not really at this stage anymore...these are few and far between now so I haven't added them on here

What do others think?

nkkingston

The thing is you can't afford to be that generous any more. As AnotherJoe points out, it's a new boiler every year. You're risking the ability to heat your home over a dinner lady's farewell card. You can't afford to donate to leaving gifts in the position you're in. Birthday parties need to happen at home, not at the bowling alley. Mother's/Father's day etc needs to be homemade presents (maybe from the boys - what grandparent doesn't love a slightly sticky homemade card?). Cook a romantic dinner for each other's birthdays (or volunteer a day's babysitting!), give each other mix CDs, write each other love letters, spoil each other rotten emotionally for anniversaries. Let the aunts and uncles know that you can't afford to send gifts right now - if postage is the big issue, maybe send your siblings the money and ask them to buy something on your behalf. Give the kids clothes for Christmas.

Something things are harder to give up than others, depending on how many people you're willing to be open with about your situation. Birthday parties with school friends, for example, can be a hard cut. Adults are easier because they're more likely to appreciate something homemade. At the end of the day, if you can get your present spend down even to £50pm you could clear two of those credit cards before the end of the year. One birthday at home for each boy, one year off from presents for adults, of feeling guilty for not donating to leaving gifts, of homemade mother's/father's day, of spoiling each other with actions rather than purchases for your anniversary.

Debt_Denier

nkkingston wrote: »

The thing is you can't afford to be that generous any more. As AnotherJoe points out, it's a new boiler every year. You're risking the ability to heat your home over a dinner lady's farewell card. You can't afford to donate to leaving gifts in the position you're in. Birthday parties need to happen at home, not at the bowling alley. Mother's/Father's day etc needs to be homemade presents (maybe from the boys - what grandparent doesn't love a slightly sticky homemade card?). Cook a romantic dinner for each other's birthdays (or volunteer a day's babysitting!), give each other mix CDs, write each other love letters, spoil each other rotten emotionally for anniversaries. Let the aunts and uncles know that you can't afford to send gifts right now - if postage is the big issue, maybe send your siblings the money and ask them to buy something on your behalf. Give the kids clothes for Christmas.

Something things are harder to give up than others, depending on how many people you're willing to be open with about your situation. Birthday parties with school friends, for example, can be a hard cut. Adults are easier because they're more likely to appreciate something homemade. At the end of the day, if you can get your present spend down even to £50pm you could clear two of those credit cards before the end of the year. One birthday at home for each boy, one year off from presents for adults, of feeling guilty for not donating to leaving gifts, of homemade mother's/father's day, of spoiling each other with actions rather than purchases for your anniversary.

Thanks for reply. I also posted this as a seperate thread because I think it is a genuinely interesting topic even if i wasn't in debt. I was totally horrified when I totted it up.

It is probably more like £1400 so 115 pcm when I actually break it down but it is still ridiculous. I was thinking about the cash for niece's etc only recently and that would definitely help on postage. They are (some of them) getting to an age where they would appreciate that I think or I could email an amazon voucher.

really great ideas on here. Very glad I asked.

AnotherJoe

Debt_Denier wrote: »

I would love to know what other parents/aunts uncles etc do?
I don't really know to be honest and really add it up. 12 times 150 is £1800. Is that really that unrealistic?
Usually I just add this sort of thing into my shopping trolley and not think about it.

And there's your problem. You are going into debt for these !

Essentially at root you seem to think these are things people are entitled to. If I got a present from someone and found out they'd had to borrow the money for it, I'd think they were a sandwich short of a picnic.

From what you've reported, getting a new boiler was a financial crisis that pushed you to the edge. Yet you are in essence buying a new boiler every year !!

Same goes for a lot of your expenditure. You need to set a budget and stick to it. Tell people you are sorry you are in financial dire straits,you cant afford presents.