Landlord denying I am on AST

danslenoir

I moved into a flatshare last year and recently moved out. Landlord has deducted funds from deposit as he feels the room is not clean. It is clean, but not perfect, just as was the case when I moved in.

Examples landlord provided of it not being clean are some streaks on the shower door glass, chrome tap, and limescale on the shower head. Pretty minor stuff, and there were similarly minor imperfections when I moved in.

I stated this to landlord and requested details of where my deposit was held as I couldn't find it with one of the deposit protection schemes.

I just got a pretty angry email back saying the room was clean when I moved in, the deposit protection scheme doesn't apply as I am not on an assured short hold tenancy, and it wasn't set up to let tenants blackmail landlords. This bit about the AST is surprising, as I feel pretty sure that's exactly what it is. Here is the wording of my agreement:

The Property (hereinafter call the Property) Room Two XXXXX XXXXXX

The Landlord (hereinafter call the Landlord) XXXXX

Of XXXXXX

This is the Landlord’s address for service of notices until the Tenant is notified of a different address in England and Wales.

The Tenant (hereinafter called the Tenant) ___XXXXX

Where the Tenant consists of more than one person they will all have joint and several liability under this Agreement (this means that they will each be liable for all sums due under this Agreement, not just liable for a proportionate part)

The Guarantor (hereinafter called the Guarantor) __________________________

Of _______________________________________________________________

The Term 6 months beginning on 20th December 2014 (hereinafter call the fixed period) The tenancy will then continue, still subject to the terms and conditions set out in this Agreement, from month to month from the end of this fixed period unless or until the Tenant or landlord gives notice that he wishes to end the Agreement as set out in clause 4 overleaf, or a new form of Agreement is entered into or this Agreement is ended by consent


The agreement was not extended and went into a rolling periodic tenancy at the end of the term.

Can someone advise who is right about it being an AST or not?

I'm not trying to be an !!!!, and the missing funds is neither here nor there, I'm contesting it out of principle because I strongly believe there is no cause for any funds to be deducted.

Thanks.

anselld

Where does the Landlord live?

Pixie5740

Did your landlord live in the same property as you?

Pixie5740

Snap

...........

danslenoir

He lives elsewhere.

One of his ex-wives lives in one of the rooms, but I haven't seen him once since I moved in.

danslenoir

Hmmm. Should have done some more homework first. I'm pretty sure he lived in the house once as his main property, so I guess it might not be an AST after all...



Owner Occupier Tenancy Agreement
This is for use where you let your own home. You should only use it if you have actually lived yourself in the property and when you lived there it was your only or main home. It does not matter how long ago; nor does it matter that you did not actually own the property when you lived there. If there is more than one landlord then only one of the landlords needs to have lived in the property as his/her only or main home at the time. The agreement creates a non shorthold assured tenancy. Unlike a shorthold, the tenant does not have the guarantee of a minimum of six months right of occupation from when he/she originally moved in. However, the tenant will be able to live in the property for however long you provide for in the agreement itself (so long as they pay the rent and comply with the tenancy terms). Thus, if you give the tenant a 12 month tenancy he/she can stay there for that period even though it may be your own home. You have to give two months notice using a Section 8 Notice relying on Ground 1 to end the tenancy and obtain a Court order if the tenant will not vacate. You will not be able to obtain a Court order unless any fixed term tenancy has run out before you start Court proceedings for possession. You can serve the Ground 1 notice but you will have to wait until any fixed term has run out. It does not matter if there is a monthly tenancy in place rather than a fixed term. In that situation you can obtain possession once the two month Ground 1 notice has run its course. You can also rely on Section 8 and the other usual grounds if there are rent arrears or a breach of the tenancy terms (e.g. Ground 8 for rent arrears).

The agreement contains the statutory Ground 1 notice warning the tenant that this is an owner/occupier agreement and a Ground 1 applies. As the tenancy is a non shorthold you can take a deposit and do not need to protect it under one of the statutory schemes.

Pixie5740

Just because he used to live in the property once upon a time doesn't mean that you can't have an AST. Who did you pay your rent to? Him or the ex?

danslenoir

Pixie5740 wrote: »

Just because he used to live in the property once upon a time doesn't mean that you can't have an AST. Who did you pay your rent to? Him or the ex?

My agreement, and rent paid, is to him.

The definition of my tenancy seems to fit that cited above though, no? Which specifically says the deposit does not need to be protected.

dgtazzman

If the landlord doesn't live in the property, it is my understanding you are a tenant, not a lodger, so an AST would be relevant and your deposit should have been protected.

I'd be inclined to polity bring this to the LL's attention, with the remark that should he chose to return your deposit in full, you might no longer have the motivation to research the issue any further, otherwise he will likely find himself on the receiving end of a legal claim for failure to protect your deposit...

anselld

Pixie5740 wrote: »

Just because he used to live in the property once upon a time doesn't mean that you can't have an AST. Who did you pay your rent to? Him or the ex?

That is what I thought. However the OP quotes from the RLA website which is a reasonably authoritative source and does seem at face value to offer a loophole for previous owner occupiers.

G_M

danslenoir wrote: »

Owner Occupier Tenancy Agreement
....... The agreement creates a non shorthold assured tenancy. .

SAT? Scotland?

In England it would be AST.

two months notice using a Section 8 Notice relying on Ground 1 to end the tenancy and obtain a Court order if the tenant will not vacate.

This is referring to S8 Notices which apply to ASTs - so yes, it is still an AST (assuming the LL did not live there during the period of your occupation, and assuming you had 'exclusive occupation' of the room in question.)

See:
Schedule 2ground 1 of Housing Act 1988.

Grounds for Possession of Dwelling-houses let on Assured Tenancies

This all relates to alternative way to end an Assured Tenancy (Shorthold or otherwise).

As an AT or AST, the deposit should have been protected. Penalty can be claimed:

* Deposits: payment, protection and return