Decent annuity rate?

dunstonh

In your last post, you didn't realise it was a US annuity.

you didnt introduce that fact until later in the thread.

You have mis-read (or are deliberately misrepresenting) my point about 4 IFAs (I didn't once say there were 2, I said there were 4 - 2 in each country. 2 x 2 = 4).

So, its two IFAs then.

What products "are not available to me"?? US annuities? Yes they are. UK annuities? Yes they are.

Tell me how you are going to buy this UK lifetime annuity then?

And yes. it IS a lifetime annuity, with a 15 year guarantee. It is guaranteed for life, or 15 years, whichever is the longer ... what is it about this that you think is incorrect?

This is a UK site. If you are talking about overseas products then it is helpful to mention that. Lifetime annuity is a specific term for a UK annuity. One that is not available to you.

dunroving

dunstonh wrote: »

you didnt introduce that fact until later in the thread.



So, its two IFAs then.



Tell me how you are going to buy this UK lifetime annuity then?



This is a UK site. If you are talking about overseas products then it is helpful to mention that. Lifetime annuity is a specific term for a UK annuity. One that is not available to you.

:wall:

Quote from recent correspondence from Tennessee ORP administrators:

"There are many annuity payment options available. The projections below are for monthly payments for a lifetime annuity based on a single life without guarantee, a single life with a 10-year guarantee period, and a single life with a 15-year guarantee period".

- and can you explain why is a UK lifetime annuity not available to me?

dunstonh

- and can you explain why is a UK lifetime annuity not available to me?

Do you have money in a UK pension?

dunroving

dunroving wrote: »

Thanks for bringing those two things up. Luckily, I can have the annuity (and any other withdrawals if I don't go that route) wired by TIAA-CREF at no charge, to a UK or US bank account, in either GBP (at very close to the mid-rate) or USD. Except if the exchange rate goes completely pear-shaped I'd likely have the payments regularly converted to GBP to spread the volatility in the GBP/USD.


Re: The 90% discount on the amount taxed by HMRC, I have learned that from another forum but I appreciate you pointing out this advantage as it helps with the calculations.


Overall, as this is only a minor part of my US and UK pension investments I will likely go with the US-based annuity opportunity as from the information I can find, no UK annuity would come close. I have the flexibility across UK state pension, SIPPS, ISAs, US Social Security, TIAA-CREF 401a, and a UK defined benefit pension to do some of the alternatives suggested here. I'll retire on a pretty modest income (despite the number of different sources!)and am trying to balance good value/security/protection of capital with maximum simplicity!

dunstonh wrote: »

Do you have money in a UK pension?

Again, stuff I already said before your post.


Just out of interest, what is your expert opinion on the point of the original question - is this a better deal than I'd get on a UK annuity? Whether the current offer on the table is in the US or UK is nether here nor there, as I could repatriate the money (or use other funds) to buy a UK annuity. I just am interested in whether I am better taking this opportunity from the US.


[Actually, I have a pretty good idea now as some people have actually helped me try to answer it rather than engage in a bun-fight]

dunstonh

Again, stuff I already said before your post.

But its impossible to know if you are talking about a US pension or a UK pension because it keeps going back and forward.

as I could repatriate the money (or use other funds) to buy a UK annuity.

But not a lifetime annuity. That would then change the annuity type and the taxation method.

Just out of interest, what is your expert opinion on the point of the original question - is this a better deal than I'd get on a UK annuity?

Dont know. Insufficient information to go on. You cant get 15 year guarantee in the UK at the moment. However, last annuity I did with a 10 year guarantee (the current maximum) was over 7% at 65.

dunroving

dunstonh wrote: »

But its impossible to know if you are talking about a US pension or a UK pension because it keeps going back and forward.



But not a lifetime annuity. That would then change the annuity type and the taxation method.



Dont know. Insufficient information to go on. You cant get 15 year guarantee in the UK at the moment. However, last annuity I did with a 10 year guarantee (the current maximum) was over 7% at 65.

Keeps going backward and forward?? What are you talking about? None of the other posters seems to have had any difficulty asking questions and following the flow of information (and none of them has been condescending one bit). You just seem to read enough bits and pieces here and there to pick up the next bone of contention.


It was a simple question - is there a UK product that can match the product in Post #1? What is so difficult about that?


The very reason I kept it simple in the first place and didn't mention it was a US product is because I knew why I was asking, and it would only cloud the issue to give too much unnecessary detail in the first post. Your responses have only proved to illustrate I was correct to be cautious.


To clarify the main points:


I have funds in the US with a provider that will give me a lifetime level single-life annuity with 15-year guarantee at the rates I already stated, at age 60 or 65 (I'm looking at 60).


I am able to take out an annuity in the UK if I wish to. I could either repatriate US money to help me fund it, or use existing SIPP funds.


I just wanted to know how the deal in Post #1 compares to ANYTHING mildly relevant in the UK. If there is no exact equivalent, information on the best/most similar is enough. I just need to get some idea of whether a UK annuity would provide better terms (so far it seems the answer is No).


Based on what you said above, it seems the TIAA-CREF/TN ORP option (see Post #1) is better because the rate at 65 years was 6.8% with a 15-year guarantee. If the best you have got before is a 7% with a 10-year guarantee, I don't know why you didn't just say that in the first place. Even though it's not the same it indicates to me that the original deal is superior.


What's the best deal you have got previously on a single-life level annuity with 10-year guarantee at age 60? [ETA: Are these healthy people with no upward adjustment for chronic illness you're quoting for? 7%+ for a healthy person seems way higher than anything currently on the market]

If this is what I can expect when I ask an IFA for help, I think I'll continue doing without.

atush

Not all of the other posters were constantly posting, some of us were just reading.

And you did not say if the money was in a UK pension, and you did change things as you went on.

Really you need a US site.

Gtekser

From what has been portrayed in the way of being help by Dunstonh who seems to be in or know the Pensions industry UK wise. I am aghast at the conceited and self opinionated troll nature of the replies which continue to try and intimidate someone who asks a seeking advise question in a perplexing area.

I guess I will have to go elsewhere looking for help. The FCA has already said the annuities market is not working well for consumers. The acknowledgement that Pension providers fail to alert customer to the benefits of shopping around is only a small part. So that’s where/when I started in doing a comparison. Then get knocked back by Companies not wanting to play ball except through a ‘Advisor’.
Pity FCA don’t force a simple shop window approach like shopping around for car insurance. Ask for a quote and you get one. I’m gone……….

dunroving

atush wrote: »

Not all of the other posters were constantly posting, some of us were just reading.

And you did not say if the money was in a UK pension, and you did change things as you went on.

Really you need a US site.

I have a US site and understand the US side of things, thanks. My question was posted on here because it pertains to a UK question - is there a UK annuity product that can beat these terms? Why does that require a US site?


I didn't change things. I added information only, which is the way these forums work, surely? What part of my story did I change?

dunstonh

From what has been portrayed in the way of being help by Dunstonh who seems to be in or know the Pensions industry UK wise. I am aghast at the conceited and self opinionated troll nature of the replies which continue to try and intimidate someone who asks a seeking advise question in a perplexing area.

In your first post on this site, you accused me and others of cloak and dagger tactics, operating cartels, not giving best offers, only offering what is best for our backpockets and not yours. Yet you accuse me of trolling?

The FCA has already said the annuities market is not working well for consumers.

It wasnt. Despite providers telling people about the open market option and that it will likely result in a higher annuity rate, the majority of people continued to buy an annuity direct from the provider which was lower than what an IFA could get them.

The acknowledgement that Pension providers fail to alert customer to the benefits of shopping around is only a small part.

The pension providers have been alerting people for years. It had been a mandatory requirement for some time. The problem was people were ignoring it.

Then get knocked back by Companies not wanting to play ball except through a ‘Advisor’.

Companies retail their products through shops and other distribution channels of their choosing. As has been said a number of times now, you can buy products without advice. However, the pricing of the annuity may not be as good as you can get via an adviser.

Pity FCA don’t force a simple shop window approach like shopping around for car insurance. Ask for a quote and you get one. I’m gone……….

And just look at the problems comparison sites have generated and why there are reviews taking place on them. That said, you can buy your annuity that way (as mentioned already) but with the caveat that it may not be the best rate (just as the same can be said about car insurance pricing on comparison sites).