Overpayment of Wages after leaving the company - Estoppel case

Luke_Alderson

Hi.

For the last 4 weeks of my employment I was off work on work related stress. I was entitled to one week full pay and 3 weeks sick pay. I handed my notice in and had the notice period as sick. I had worked out how much I expected in my final pay. When i received this pay I thought I was short approx £100. So I rang the said companies HR department and the lady said my pay was correct etc. So I left believing okay that money is correct and mine.

After you leave the company you can still access your payslips for one month. Apparently I had another payslip in November (but no money went in my bank) but even if I had wanted to login and look I couldn't have as my access was cut off as it was over a month after I left. All this payslip said was that I was overpaid by some £250 and as no money went in my bank I didn't even realise this payslip existed.

So, now they claim I was overpaid etc etc. I used the money in my final pay to live off, i.e. it went on rent, council tax and food/petrol. I had no idea I was overpaid, infact they have on record the fact I rang them to query being UNDERPAID. I have spent the money and am still paying of family members from whom I lent money off as I struggled for a few months.

They have admitted it was an error on their behalf.

Anyone know where I stand on this? Will they take me to a small claims for £250?

Thanks for any help/advice in advance.

Undervalued

In 99.99% of cases an employer can lawfully recover any accidental overpayment of wages.

Estoppel, in these cases is often talked about on forums like this and no doubt down the pub, but the situations were it has been successfully applied are very few indeed.

Nothing in your post suggests it would work here. What you did with the money, your health and your family are totally irrelevant apart perhaps for appealing to their good nature.

By all means argue with them, attempt to negotiate and certainly check their calculations. However, I suspect if the do take you to the small claims court they will win.

Gavin83

Luke_Alderson wrote: »

After you leave the company you can still access your payslips for one month. Apparently I had another payslip in November (but no money went in my bank) but even if I had wanted to login and look I couldn't have as my access was cut off as it was over a month after I left. All this payslip said was that I was overpaid by some £250 and as no money went in my bank I didn't even realise this payslip existed.

Sorry I'm confused here. If the payslip exists and the money wasn't put in your account how did you receive it? If they never paid you the money they can't claim it as an overpayment!

Luke_Alderson

Undervalued wrote: »

In 99.99% of cases an employer can lawfully recover any accidental overpayment of wages.

Estoppel, in these cases is often talked about on forums like this and no doubt down the pub, but the situations were it has been successfully applied are very few indeed.

Nothing in your post suggests it would work here. What you did with the money, your health and your family are totally irrelevant apart perhaps for appealing to their good nature.

By all means argue with them, attempt to negotiate and certainly check their calculations. However, I suspect if the do take you to the small claims court they will win.

I appreciate that but if the case is there for a reason surely it must come into play sometimes.

I rang them to query about being underpaid, they categorically told me it was correct. I assume calls to HR are recorded? So In my mind that money is mine lawfully, so I spent it to live off. Rent, food, petrol etc.

Under the 3 points to Estoppel I feel confident that I meet the criteria for every one comfortably. Most people fail to meet the first one.

tomtontom

Gavin83 wrote: »

Sorry I'm confused here. If the payslip exists and the money wasn't put in your account how did you receive it? If they never paid you the money they can't claim it as an overpayment!

I'm reading it as the pay slip had a negative figure on it.

OP, do you agree with their calculation and the reason behind it? I would agree with Undervalued, this is not a situation where estoppel could be argued, mainly because it is too straightforward and true estoppel cases rarely are!

Luke_Alderson

Gavin83 wrote: »

Sorry I'm confused here. If the payslip exists and the money wasn't put in your account how did you receive it? If they never paid you the money they can't claim it as an overpayment!

Sorry my fault I made it confusing.

They paid me my final pay in October when they claim the overpayment was made.

Then in November I had a payslip of £0 claiming I was overpaid in October. I could not access this even If I wanted too because it was after the 4 week allowance (but i wouldn't have checked anyway as my final pay was October)

tomtontom

Luke_Alderson wrote: »

I appreciate that but if the case is there for a reason surely it must come into play sometimes.

I rang them to query about being underpaid, they categorically told me it was correct. I assume calls to HR are recorded? So In my mind that money is mine lawfully, so I spent it to live off. Rent, food, petrol etc.

Under the 3 points to Estoppel I feel confident that I meet the criteria for every one comfortably. Most people fail to meet the first one.

You did not commit to spending because of the additional money, you would have incurred these outgoings anyway. That is not an estoppel scenario.

Luke_Alderson

tomtontom wrote: »

I'm reading it as the pay slip had a negative figure on it.

OP, do you agree with their calculation and the reason behind it? I would agree with Undervalued, this is not a situation where estoppel could be argued, mainly because it is too straightforward and true estoppel cases rarely are!

They have explained how the overpayment occurred yes, It is confusing and Im no Payroll expert but I believe what they are saying however it was their mistake.

Can you just clear up why Estoppel would not apply in this case as I must be missing something. There is no way they can prove I was aware of overpayment, far from it as I contacted them to query being underpaid.

Luke_Alderson

tomtontom wrote: »

You did not commit to spending because of the additional money, you would have incurred these outgoings anyway. That is not an estoppel scenario.

I thought that it was just a case of proving I had spent the money. Which I can, I spent it on normal living costs.

Undervalued

Luke_Alderson wrote: »

I thought that it was just a case of proving I had spent the money. Which I can, I spent it on normal living costs.

Short answer - No!

The fact that it was their mistake does not, in itself, give you any right to keep the money.

To have any chance at all you would need to convince a court that you had a really good reason to truly believe you were entitled to the money and had therefore spent it in good faith.

Not checking your pay carefully, which is as much your responsibility as theirs, doesn't even come close.

Sorry, but this is one of these "old wives tales" that crops up here from time to time like the myth that "you can't give a bad reference"!

Incidentally, that is very likely to happen if they have to sue you for their money back!

Luke_Alderson

Undervalued wrote: »

Short answer - No!

The fact that it was their mistake does not, in itself, give you any right to keep the money.

To have any chance at all you would need to convince a court that you had a really good reason to truly believe you were entitled to the money and had therefore spent it in good faith.

Not checking your pay carefully, which is as much your responsibility as theirs, doesn't even come close.

Sorry, but this is one of these "old wives tales" that crops up here from time to time like the myth that "you can't give a bad reference"!

Incidentally, that is very likely to happen if they have to sue you for their money back!

Ofcourse I thought I was entitled to it. It was a weeks full pay and my sick pay. Plus the fact I rang them and they themselves confirmed MY PAY WAS CORRECT. if that isn't enough to convince me I was entitled then I do not know what is???