Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

Shakethedisease

CLAPTON wrote: »

a lot of SNP voters do hold the 'anyone by the English ' views
and do hold that Flower of Scotland would make a suitable anthem

so in many ways they are different to other people although taking a historical perspective, you could call them 'ordinary'.

It's likely that many labour supporters whether Scottish or not, will support more English borrowing and more state handouts, rather than focusing on how Scotland can produce more goods and services and create long term wealth.

There are a wide range of views on any political spectrum. Most are in the middle, hence 'ordinary'. Same applies to the SNP as with any other political party. They are nothing unique in that. McSkinflint would try and have us all believe otherwise, which is not truthful and more reflective of his own views and 'othering' anyone who votes for them.

I'm an ordinary mum/grandmother. Married to an Englishman who while not agreeing with SNP policy 100%, believes they will further my area's interests and Scotland's far better than Labour has evidenced in the last 40 years. It's also interesting that the SNP have gained support from ordinary Scots not through traditional media/newspaper outlets but overwhelmingly despite it. This suggests deep rooted discontent with the status quo.

Labour have had a long time to prove what they can do in Scotland and have introduced many positive things along the way. However, their drift rightwards and away from their grassroots core support in the last decade has cost them dear.

Time to give someone else a chance to approach things differently now. Be that independence, FFA or anti-austerity measures/calls. Half of the Scottish electorate wanted to give them that chance rather than return Labour/Lib Dems or Tory MP's to Westminster this time round. These voters are by and large not brainwashed NATS. How could they be ? No-one ever seems to have anything positive to say re the SNP on national media. No, they're just ordinary people who have gone out and sought the information for themselves and voted accordingly.

Shakethedisease

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Well the SNP have made no positive contribution to how the UK should balance it's books. Anti austerity is not a policy. It's populist politics. Fortunately there's enough people with common sense enough to see through that spin.

Actually, it is a policy. Sorry. Labour's was kind of similar too. Though they seem to have ditched them all with Miliband's resignation.

Tromking

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Time to give someone else a chance to approach things differently now. Be that independence, FFA or anti-austerity measures/calls. Half of the Scottish electorate wanted to give them that chance rather than return Labour/Lib Dems or Tory MP's to Westminster this time round.

Well then.
Independance was roundly rejected not 12 months ago.
Regarding FFA, even the SNP doesn`t want it anytime soon because it blows a hole (another one!) in the economic case for a Scotland free from the English subsidy.
There's even a school of thought which says that Scotland avoids the worst effects of austerity anyway.

http://www.publicfinance.co.uk/news/2014/11/barnett-formula-%E2%80%98protected-scotland-cuts%E2%80%99-ifs-finds

CLAPTON

Shakethedisease wrote: »

There are a wide range of views on any political spectrum. Most are in the middle, hence 'ordinary'. Same applies to the SNP as with any other political party. They are nothing unique in that. McSkinflint would try and have us all believe otherwise, which is not truthful and more reflective of his own views and 'othering' anyone who votes for them.

I'm an ordinary mum/grandmother. Married to an Englishman who while not agreeing with SNP policy 100%, believes they will further my area's interests and Scotland's far better than Labour has evidenced in the last 40 years. It's also interesting that the SNP have gained support from ordinary Scots not through traditional media/newspaper outlets but overwhelmingly despite it. This suggests deep rooted discontent with the status quo.

Labour have had a long time to prove what they can do in Scotland and have introduced many positive things along the way. However, their drift rightwards and away from their grassroots core support in the last decade has cost them dear.

Time to give someone else a chance to approach things differently now. Be that independence, FFA or anti-austerity measures/calls. Half of the Scottish electorate wanted to give them that chance rather than return Labour/Lib Dems or Tory MP's to Westminster this time round. These voters are by and large not brainwashed NATS. How could they be ? No-one ever seems to have anything positive to say re the SNP on national media. No, they're just ordinary people who have gone out and sought the information for themselves and voted accordingly.

Indeeds so there is nothing unique about 'any one but the English' attitudes : the racist equivalents are common amoungst 'ordinary' people all over the world.

Difficult to see what the 'deep rooted discount' is about what exactly?
about the 'anything but the English ' racist attitude?
about heavy subsidises for rich parents of uni students and rich graduates?
about wanting more English handouts?

or is it the vague 'status quo' like Uni students with a little bit of learning about sociology?

kabayiri

It was interesting on the Daily Politics show today.

A topic was how successful the "vote Labour, get SNP" campaign theme was. In short, it seems it was highly effective.

They interviewed people in London who were openly worried about being run by remote politicians in Scotland ! A weak Miliband figure simply reinforced the puppet role.

How ironic! This is the oft-quoted complaint levied at "Westminster" by pro-SNP people, except the other way around!

The independence referendum followed so closely by the GE seems to have awakened a "let Scotland go if they want to" sentiment down here.

If the SNP were smart they would campaign for an English independence referendum. This would have good chance of delivering the by-product they seek - Scottish breakaway.

chewmylegoff

Shakethedisease wrote: »

So ? Are you saying you personally know better or that she was lying in her article ?

I'm saying it is a moneyweek article not an ft piece as you attempted to claim it was in order to give it some kind of credibility.

skintmacflint

Shakethedisease wrote: »

You lost the election mcskinflint. Try and get over it.;)

Once you can prove your no doubt extensive psychology credentials and qualifications, then I may take your points onboard about 'mindsets of dedicated followers'.. But most SNP voters are just ordinary people who've weighed things up and made up their minds on a personal informed basis.

Using the word 'NATS' is just 'othering' ( you should know what that is being a psychology expert ).. but doesn't make those who vote SNP any different from you in terms of how they came to their own conclusions. Just ordinary people like you, who vote for a different political party. There are no 'true NATS' any more than there are 'true LIB DEMS' or 'true TORIES'. Because you have no idea what you are saying by that. It's in essence just an angry attempt to put down ordinary people who vote differently from yourself.

We'll see how 'entrenched' those anti-SNP views are, when those billions of cuts start coming down the line. People tend to get significantly less entrenched in their views, when it starts hurting in their pockets. Scottish Labour voters in particular recently, are becoming less 'entrenched' by the week.

Another pot kettle black response. Yawn zzzzzzzz.

PS - as someone who wanted a Conservative government, the election worked out just fine for me . Lol.

skintmacflint

kabayiri wrote: »

If the SNP were smart they would campaign for an English independence referendum. This would have good chance of delivering the by-product they seek - Scottish breakaway.

At the minute they're too busy to think of this. The Westminster crew are still tied up plotting how to oust Dennis Skinner from his seat, 3 weeks in, and the MSPs are locked up with John Swinney trying to work out the best excuses for not committing to using their new tax raising powers in 2016.

Shakethedisease

Tromking wrote: »

Well then.
Independance was roundly rejected not 12 months ago.
Regarding FFA, even the SNP doesn`t want it anytime soon because it blows a hole (another one!) in the economic case for a Scotland free from the English subsidy.
There's even a school of thought which says that Scotland avoids the worst effects of austerity anyway.

http://www.publicfinance.co.uk/news/2014/11/barnett-formula-%E2%80%98protected-scotland-cuts%E2%80%99-ifs-finds

So you're saying the SNP don't want independence, a mere 9 months after spending the best part of 3 years campaigning for it, and the entire lifetime as a political party since 1934, having an independent Scotland as a main policy.

Come back when you've thought all that through a little more carefully.

Shakethedisease

kabayiri wrote: »

It was interesting on the Daily Politics show today.

A topic was how successful the "vote Labour, get SNP" campaign theme was. In short, it seems it was highly effective.

They interviewed people in London who were openly worried about being run by remote politicians in Scotland ! A weak Miliband figure simply reinforced the puppet role.

How ironic! This is the oft-quoted complaint levied at "Westminster" by pro-SNP people, except the other way around!

The independence referendum followed so closely by the GE seems to have awakened a "let Scotland go if they want to" sentiment down here.

If the SNP were smart they would campaign for an English independence referendum. This would have good chance of delivering the by-product they seek - Scottish breakaway.

You're a little late to the party. The Tories used anti-Snp/Scots rhetoric all through the campaign. And you're right.. it didn't do much for union sentiment on either side.... As was pointed out to you several times in the run up to the election. You dismissed it as simply the Tories/Labour being 'upfront' about not wanting the SNP anywhere near power.

But it went much, much further than that. You've just reached the conclusion a little later than most others did. People in London being 'openly worried' about being run by politicians from Scotland doesn't say much for the Union does it ? ( Scots at the moment being run with a mere 1 MP from the chosen UK government party ). Some of us are openly worried about that also !

Welcome to the world of headlines proclaiming 'The most dangerous woman in Britain' and 'Rivers of blood ( Thames )' and the sort of damage they do in terms of the UK. Thankfully a fair few in Scotland don't bother with that sort of group brainwashing any more.