Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

Would FFA be an advantage? - remember what I pointed out before; FFA would mean that Scotland did not contribute enough to the UK to earn financial security. If they did contribute anything you can be sure it would only be a nominal amount and since everything would be under Scottish Full Fiscal Control even that is not certain if Scotland gets into financial difficulties (think Greece).

If Scotland's finances went bust or even downhill, it would leave the UK with an obligation to bail them out. That would be far too risky for us poor sods who would have to foot the bill; it's the same situation that we all discussed in connection with a separated Scotland formally keeping the pound.


FFA is not compatible with Union, as I keep pointing out.

Well what do you do if most people in a specific electorate want it ?

Yet more results from the YouGov poll have now been released - the reason for the time-lag is that there was more than one client. The finding that leaps out at me the most is this one...

If there is a hung Parliament and the SNP hold the balance of power, do you think they should or should not request each of the following in exchange for supporting a Westminster government?

Greatly expanded devolution to Scotland, including all powers except defence and foreign policy?

Should ask for this : 61%
Should not ask for this : 29%

For the avoidance of doubt, the above results come from all respondents, regardless of how they plan to vote in May. No fewer than 89% of people currently planning to vote SNP (ie. the people that Labour are theoretically trying to win back) want Nicola Sturgeon to demand full Devo Max, and only 6% don't.

I'm not sure the current tactics ( campaign wise ) of Labour are quite the most sensible at the moment. They're even talking about wheeling Gordon Brown out again to argue against precisely what he seemed to be offering during the referendum.

CLAPTON

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Well what do you do if most people in a specific electorate want it ?



I'm not sure the current tactics ( campaign wise ) of Labour are quite the most sensible at the moment. They're even talking about wheeling Gordon Brown out again to argue against precisely what he seemed to be offering during the referendum.

one would love to think that the whole thing was a double bluff : but unfortunately Dave and Ed are too stupid

-Dave and Ed fight dev max until the Scots are unified in wanting it
-reluctantly give way and abolish the disgraceful Barnett formula
-SNP try to live with a 10% budget cut and have to raise taxes, cut benefits for the rich etc

SNP get kicked out of power for a generation
one can but dream.

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Well what do you do if most people in a specific electorate want it ?

I would try to achieve what they decided in their Referendum and not lead them up a garden path which is inconsistent with their decision and moreover economic idiocy.

Meanwhile, Storm Clouds gather:

Election 2015: Labour and SNP in tax 'black hole' row

BBC wrote:

The Scottish National Party's economic plans are "unravelling" and would have a "devastating" impact on Scotland, Labour leader Ed Miliband has warned.

He said the SNP's aim for Scotland to have full control of taxation would create a £7.6bn financial "black hole".

It comes as one poll gave the SNP a 24-point lead over Labour.

The SNP says Labour is "simply making this up". Leader Nicola Sturgeon said it was the usual "fears and smears" from a party backing Conservative cuts.

Her deputy Stewart Hosie told BBC News that Labour's figures - taken from independent Institute for Fiscal Studies data - were based on the current financial year, when tax control could not transfer. They did not take into account the effect of SNP anti-austerity policies to grow the economy, he added.

Also:
Election 2015: Parties clash on Scottish finance plans

The SNP still think that they can wave imaginary Magic Powers while chanting their infantile anti-tory rants and then engage in profligate and amoral spending.

Soon to be comeuppance time.

skintmacflint

Meanwhile Wings Over Scotland and it's followers are in a flux, following the Rev Stu's attempt to backpedal spin IMO on behalf of SNP.

In article No 161 Tilting at Windmills, the honourable Rev states his opinion that

'FFA is currently a weakness in the SNPs policy position . Before the the referendum we identified it as a trap , and SNP have rather carelessly blundered into it'

He then states, SNP can't deliver it, blah blah etc.

The 162 comments following it are hilarious, as people ask him to confirm his opinion, and some argue the case and others ask well what was the point of the referendum or voting SNP. Lol.

Seems to me SNP are in trouble with this, no matter what now. St Nicola has really put her big high heels in the do doo with this one.

Thrugelmir

Shakethedisease wrote: »

One thing I do have to point out though,is that there are many Scots sick hearing about how crap Scotland was, is and will be forever more, and can see no way of changing that through the current status quo. Something's gonna give sooner or later. And the current boring old re-run of independence arguements against FFA, and from Labour ?. are falling on a lot of deaf ears.

One thing for sure is that politicians won't alter the perception. People will do the changing. That's if they can be bothered too.

Shakethedisease

.string. wrote: »

I would try to achieve what they decided in their Referendum and not lead them up a garden path which is inconsistent with their decision and moreover economic idiocy.

Meanwhile, Storm Clouds gather:

Election 2015: Labour and SNP in tax 'black hole' row


Also:
Election 2015: Parties clash on Scottish finance plans

The SNP still think that they can wave imaginary Magic Powers while chanting their infantile anti-tory rants and then engage in profligate and amoral spending.

Soon to be comeuppance time.

As I've already stated. These sort of headlines are everyday news in Scotland, and have been for the last 3 years. We're all kind of used to financial 'blackhole's' and the SNP in the same headline. They obviously aren't working. Comeuppance time is just your own wishful thinking taking over.

CLAPTON

Shakethedisease wrote: »

As I've already stated. These sort of headlines are everyday news in Scotland, and have been for the last 3 years. We're all kind of used to financial 'blackhole's' and the SNP in the same headline. They obviously aren't working. Comeuppance time is just your own wishful thinking taking over.

remind us
what was the result of the free democratic vote of the northern part of the UK about independence and full financial freedom?

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

As I've already stated. These sort of headlines are everyday news in Scotland, and have been for the last 3 years. We're all kind of used to financial 'blackhole's' and the SNP in the same headline. They obviously aren't working. Comeuppance time is just your own wishful thinking taking over.

And yet so many still want to vote for self-induced poverty.

As HAMISH puts it, why on earth would the Scots turn away a £15,000,000,000 a year subsidy from London and the SE? It's nuts. Stupidity on a truly epic scale.

Shakethedisease

skintmacflint wrote: »

Meanwhile Wings Over Scotland and it's followers are in a flux, following the Rev Stu's attempt to backpedal spin IMO on behalf of SNP.

In article No 161 Tilting at Windmills, the honourable Rev states his opinion that

'FFA is currently a weakness in the SNPs policy position . Before the the referendum we identified it as a trap , and SNP have rather carelessly blundered into it'

He then states, SNP can't deliver it, blah blah etc.

The 162 comments following it are hilarious, as people ask him to confirm his opinion, and some argue the case and others ask well what was the point of the referendum or voting SNP. Lol.

Seems to me SNP are in trouble with this, no matter what now. St Nicola has really put her big high heels in the do doo with this one.

But the SNP can't deliver FFA can they mcskinflint ? All Labour, Tories and Lib Dems have to do is vote against it, or even Smith commission stuff for that matter. I would've thought that would be fairly obvious to everyone ? Not you ?

They're not it big trouble with this in the slightest. If they do get it, easily, it will be a surprise ! If they don't, and Labour and Tories keep blocking further powers, then bad old Westminster once again takes the blame for not taking into account the wishes of 68% of the Scots electorate, and, ( if the polls stay as they are ) a fair whack of Scottish MP's elected on the basis of fighting for further powers.

That long game again.. You're another one that seems to keep missing the point. Blocking further powers that polling ( for the last few years ) says most Scots want to see isn't going to be popular.. But no-one thinks they'll be handed over instantly, if at all, either. Blimey, most of us will be surprised if any of the Smith commission stuff makes it through the HOC intact. :eek:

If they're not. It certainly won't be Nicola Sturgeon taking the slightest blame for it. She won't even be near Westminster. Wings is a very good source for balance ( ie with the likes of the Telegraph ).. but his opinion, is only his own on a lot of matters. He's not an SNP 'guy' and the SNP have never had anything to do with him in terms of association. Certainly wouldn't be taking asking him to 'back pedal' on their 'behalf'.

But no, the SNP cannot ever deliver FFA on their own from Westminster. He's 100%, bluntly right on that. If it is offered, fully and quickly, it'll be from the Tories ( imo ) somewhere along the line of how this election and the fallout goes. Never Labour.

zagubov

Generali wrote: »

And yet so many still want to vote for self-induced poverty.

As HAMISH puts it, why on earth would the Scots turn away a £15,000,000,000 a year subsidy from London and the SE? It's nuts. Stupidity on a truly epic scale.

Too poor- tick

Too stupid -tick.

Remind me; is it a small country as well?:D