Preparing for Winter V

MingVase

my god, here we go again.

Floss

Each and every person should weigh up their own situation, wishes and options - in line with whatever rules are in place for your region.

For me, that means a 360 mile round trip to see one of my sons & his wife, along with EITHER my 61 yo brother OR my other son, both of whom live alone. Not both. And because of their invitation to me my daughter-in-law will not be seeing her (widowed in March) father, and her two sisters & their families, who will be in their own Christmas bubble. Does my son choose his brother with mh concerns or his uncle who lives locally? 

Islandmaid

boazu said:

Funny thing that, back in the summer when I said I wasn't going to mix in again because I didn't think it would be safe or sensible I got shot out of the water by a whole lot of people ridiculed, mocked and sworn at and had my mental state questioned many times.....funny how now staying in is seen as doing your own thing and staying out of danger from the virus!  there's nowt so queer as folks is there?

Lucky you m’dear, not judging.
I, all of my immediate family and my colleagues have had to carry on with work, and not had the choice.  I am glad that anyone with the ability to choose has done so, whatever their choice.

even if I had been scared witless, I would have still been obliged to work, it’s what I signed up to do, DD is an ICU nurse and has worked in the ‘Red’ wards from day one, I have every admiration for anyone who has not has the choice, especially those who has to work during the early days without PPE, Bus drivers, shop workers, bin persons etc all carried on without choice, and those of you that stayed at home helped by minimising the spread and I’m sure you will continue to isolate to continue that minimisation to spread, especially from high contagious areas to low.

It’s had an impact of all, we can only do what we can. 

Nargleblast

If all those who plan to spend Christmas with people from outside their households follow the rules/guidelines and apply common sense then hopefully a happy Christmas will be had by all. There will, however, be many who will not do that.

 In the couple of weeks or so leading up to Christmas we should be on the lookout for any suspicious symptoms or general feelings of being unwell. We should observe social distancing where possible, observe the hygiene rules, wear masks in indoor places. Those who have thermometers should check their temperatures before going to any Christmas gathering and do a last minute checklist for symptoms. If you have a cough, fever, generally feel unwell then don't go to Christmas lunch with the family. It is just not worth the risk. If you visit family on Christmas Day then don't go visiting other people the same day, or having other people round your house later. The key, I think, is to avoid excessive social contact. The more contacts, the higher the risk. With this virus you cannot predict who, out of your social circle, will have mild symptoms, who will be very ill or who will die. It kills 30 year olds with no previous medical history whilst letting 80 year olds walk out of hospital cured. That's the scary part of it. Just when you think you have got your head round it you see another person die who really shouldn't have, according to conventional wisdom.

I suspect that there will be a massive rise in cases in the early part of January due to some folks not being sensible over Christmas. I hope I am wrong, I would like to think we can all gather with our families at this time of year, but there will always be the stupid element whose heads will peel back and they will lose all self control just because the government have given them permission to let their hair down a bit.

Laura_Elsewhere

We made a decision when we moved in together that we just spend Xmas together, and never go to anyone else's, so it won't change anything for us - but I am appalled that they've suggested such widespread mixing. How on earth can they think it's safe?

I notice there are now calls for them to reveal the evidence they claim to have used...

littlemoney

Nargleblast said:

If all those who plan to spend Christmas with people from outside their households follow the rules/guidelines and apply common sense then hopefully a happy Christmas will be had by all. There will, however, be many who will not do that.

 In the couple of weeks or so leading up to Christmas we should be on the lookout for any suspicious symptoms or general feelings of being unwell. We should observe social distancing where possible, observe the hygiene rules, wear masks in indoor places. Those who have thermometers should check their temperatures before going to any Christmas gathering and do a last minute checklist for symptoms. If you have a cough, fever, generally feel unwell then don't go to Christmas lunch with the family. It is just not worth the risk. If you visit family on Christmas Day then don't go visiting other people the same day, or having other people round your house later. The key, I think, is to avoid excessive social contact. The more contacts, the higher the risk. With this virus you cannot predict who, out of your social circle, will have mild symptoms, who will be very ill or who will die. It kills 30 year olds with no previous medical history whilst letting 80 year olds walk out of hospital cured. That's the scary part of it. Just when you think you have got your head round it you see another person die who really shouldn't have, according to conventional wisdom.

I suspect that there will be a massive rise in cases in the early part of January due to some folks not being sensible over Christmas. I hope I am wrong, I would like to think we can all gather with our families at this time of year, but there will always be the stupid element whose heads will peel back and they will lose all self control just because the government have given them permission to let their hair down a bit.

Iagree with you.  In previous years the few times I have been out for a meal around christmas time I have unwell later. I easily pick up viruses.  I think people push themselves to go out and enjoy an arranged gathering/meal when perhaps they are a bit under the weather as they don't want to miss out.

Lockdown 3 is a certainty following a massive rise in cases by mid January. It was interesting to hear an virus expert on my local radio station stating that as the schools will be closed over christmas this will reduce the pressure on the R rate so though he didn't say it I assume he means that this will help offset the increase due to household mixings. It seem to be an acknowledgement that educational institutions are spreading the virus and the government is relucant to do anything about it.

According to the covid symptom study app in lockdown 2 the highest infection rates are in the 20-39 age groups and whilst most age groups are showing a decline in cases, children and young people under 19 at school and university which are stable and not declining. The presure won't go away after the christmas as all the children and students will return to schools/universitiesand have gatherings/parties to talk about their christmas, helping to spread the virus.

https://covid.joinzoe.com/post/did-lockdown-2-0-work-heres-whats-going-on-with-covid-19-across-the-country

pollyanna_26

Another laptop failure so offline for the past three weeks. Youngest dd and I discussed Christmas a while ago and decided to stick to our normal short visits. Looking back through my diary since the end of Feb when both our GP and her consultants told her to shield and have  since kept up that advice the risk seems too great. As she's been with her boyfriend since March and we have only seen each other every few weeks as a bubble the risk isn't worth it. I no longer drive so would be travelling by taxi with the knowledge the  regular drivers with proper hackneys which have a screen are takng a break whiich means I would have no idea who had travelled in the taxi or how clean the cab was. Twice I've refused a cab without a screen and a driver not wearing a mask although they are mandatory for both passenger and driver in this area.

People will make their own minds up over Christmas but I was shocked at the idea of a number of days together being ok. We were put in tier 3 a while ago although figures here were low. We were pulled in to a large region as other low case areas were. We're now in tier 2 but listening to the science we wont be spending christmas together. Dd had her 36th birthday last week and we and her doctors have spent most of those years keeping her alive. We had decades of practice during flu and norovirus season so have learned to judge risk.

What does annoy me is the lowering of the concern for the extremely clinically vulnerable. Two more identical letters last week from "Matt". Not rules but choice over christmas. Our GP is exhausted , flu injections are ongoing and the covid vaccine being rolled out , blood tests suspended due to covid infection in the nurses. The NHS have been wonderful but they are at breaking point . Winter is always a challenge with flu etc. Those who can safely see each other will be sensible but there are so many doing their own thing I fear we'll see another spike.

I was born a few days before the NHS went live and have much to thank it for. It would break my heart if all those on the frontline had to once more face overwhelming challenges after christmas.

pollyx

greenbee

@pollyanna_26 - my GP brother has xmas day and boxing day off. Although he only works 4 days a week, he is working 6 for the foreseeable future. One day a week in a Covid Hot-hub, 5 either vaccinating (he's supposed to be doing carehomes, but they need to work out how to fit them in while trying to use up 975+ doses in 3.5 days before they go off in a rural practice) or trying to squeeze in his usual patient load. Before this he was so busy his patients had a 6-week wait to see him, but they weren't allowed to recruit. My cousin is a retired nurse, starting back at work after New Year vaccinating - anyone who knows how to work a hypodermic is in demand. 

Primrose

We also have a close relative who's a GP.   I think they'll all be run into the ground with exhaustion  by the time this vaccination programme has been completed.   The least we can do to help them is to try and keep ourselves safe and healthy and not to bombard our surgeries with phone calls asking when we'll get the jab.   Our time will come - eventually !

pollyanna_26

I posted dds meds requests in the outside surgery box yesterday Primrose. There is a large clear notice on the door Do not phone we will contact you when you need to come in. It wont stop everyone phoning but hopefully those who see it or look on the website will be patient.

I've just remembered it's the Winter Solstice in a couple of days. If the conditions are right we who love looking at the skies may see a meteor shower along with the Christmas star. I haven't the energy to put many lights on a tree so am opting out of decorating this year apart from a few special bits that are in the main room all the year round and fit the scandi theme of bright red ,pale grey and silver.. I'll light the candles and send love'light and hope to all those in this strangest of years.

I've just read introduction of a tier 4 in hotspots is being considered. Shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted comes to mind.

PM, Prof Chris Witty and Sir Patrick Vallance to make a statement later. I'll have my eyes on CW. So far he's following the science, talking sense and not making rash promises.

pollyx