Section 32 problems gmp and aviva

Lekkguy

towag wrote: »

So in effect "the scheme" or anyone with an NU S32 pre 1988 will not get SFA on the GMP from SPA...
Bearing in mind that anyone "contracted out" before '88 and transferred into these NU S32 policies will get a "contracted out" reduced new state pension.... Sounds like a double hit on anyone pre '88
Correct?

Sadly,yes.

towag

xylophone wrote: »

Once you have read the weasel words in the above ( about how the state did not pay increases on GMP), this is typical of how scheme literature put it.....

http://www.lgps.org.uk/lge/core/page.do?pageId=101544


"Your pension may comprise two elements: Guaranteed Minimum Pension (GMP) and pension in excess of GMP.

"Any GMP earned before 6 April 1988 is usually increased by the State each April with the increase being paid with your State basic pension.

Any GMP earned after 6 April 1988 is usually increased by the LGPS up to 3% each year with any remaining increase being paid by the State together with your State basic pension."

In other words as I said.... Sweet F A .... My starting amount as per NSP pension forecast is £6,625.64 a year.....A short fall of £1468 .16 per annum from the maximum .... GMP without any EPR ..... double hit as I expected....

Thinks I will write to Ross Altman ..... And a lot of effing good that will do...!!

towag

Lekkguy wrote: »

Sadly,yes.

Looks like you wont be able to afford that pint after all Lekkie....

greenglide

Thinks I will write to Ross Altman

This is the case for all pension schemes with a GMP, not just S32.

Publuc sector schemes will index the GMP themselves for members with an SPa up to December 2018 because of the impact of pensions equalisation but everyone else is on their own.

The legislation for this was passed ages ago and very few people understand the mechanism so I think you will be wasting your time.

waterstar

greenglide wrote: »

This is the case for all pension schemes with a GMP, not just S32.

Publuc sector schemes will index the GMP themselves for members with an SPa up to December 2018 because of the impact of pensions equalisation but everyone else is on their own.

The legislation for this was passed ages ago and very few people understand the mechanism so I think you will be wasting your time.

I have a NU s32 scheme so like other posters I have concerns that the policy may well only pay an amount equivalent to GMP due to (1) the fund not growing adequately and (2) the low rates on annuities. So a realisation that there will be no "inflation increases" for the period until death compounds these concerns.

However I recognise that this is not unique to s32 schemes (Aviva or other providers) for i also have a DB scheme which i have claimed since earlier in my fifties which provides that payments in retirement will increase at RPI or max of 5%, however on reaching 65:

pre-88 GMP will not be increased by the scheme "and will be increased by the Govt in line with RPI and added to your basic state pension"

post 88 GMP will be increased by the scheme by RPI up to 3%.

As the pre-88 and post 88 GMP, are quite significant elements of these DB payments I realise that an outcome of the NSP arrangements is that a significant part of my pension income will not be index linked. Very much as greenglide says "very few people understand the mechanism".

towag

waterstar wrote: »

I have a NU s32 scheme so like other posters I have concerns that the policy may well only pay an amount equivalent to GMP due to (1) the fund not growing adequately and (2) the low rates on annuities. So a realisation that there will be no "inflation increases" for the period until death compounds these concerns.

However I recognise that this is not unique to s32 schemes (Aviva or other providers) for i also have a DB scheme which i have claimed since earlier in my fifties which provides that payments in retirement will increase at RPI or max of 5%, however on reaching 65:

pre-88 GMP will not be increased by the scheme "and will be increased by the Govt in line with RPI and added to your basic state pension"

post 88 GMP will be increased by the scheme by RPI up to 3%.

As the pre-88 and post 88 GMP, are quite significant elements of these DB payments I realise that an outcome of the NSP arrangements is that a significant part of my pension income will not be index linked. Very much as greenglide says "very few people understand the mechanism".

I understand it all right... The fact is a No EPR of 5% on your pre '88 NU S32 scheme which is wrong.... End of.... Only an annual increase of 2.5% on the New State Pension as opposed to the 5% EPR pre '88 originally contracted by the NU S32 scheme, now taken away by the DWP which calculates as a reduced New State Pension... Aggregate that to the now Aviva flattened pre '88 NU S32 GMP means an annual erosion of 2.5% on the pension aggregate for the rest of your natural.... Hows about that for fairness and working ones nuts off saving for one's future pride and dignity? I know for sure that things look all the more financially insecure now this has come to light.... I will write to the POS and send a copy to Ross just the same as its always worth a try.... You just never know for sure unless you do....

BTW as for the fund not growing enough, take a butchers at this.....
http://www.trustnet.com/Factsheets/Factsheet.aspx?fundCode=NQF50&univ=P

Aviva With Profit Guaranteed NU Pn GBP £39000,000,000 and still counting.... Don't believe anything that Aviva tell you waterstar....

Lekkguy

Sorts of make you think 'Why did I bother investing in a pension plan?'.

towag

Lekkguy wrote: »

Sorts of make you think 'Why did I bother investing in a pension plan?'.

To safeguard your old age and dignity....

persistancepaysoff

What did the PAS have to say regarding your complaint,did they attempt to mediate with Aviva or just refer you to the Ombudsman?
My only dealings with them via a webchat were not very good,the 1st reply from my adviser said: "There may be long silences between any replies as i am multi-chatting to other customers-bear with me."
originally posted by WBCPB

We had many e mail exchanges and they interrogated Aviva quite thoroughly before recommending me to move on to the Pensions Ombudsman. PAS is usually staffed by part time 'volunteers' and the service may be variable.

agarnett

We had many e mail exchanges {with PAS?}* and they interrogated Aviva quite thoroughly before recommending me to move on to the Pensions Ombudsman. PAS is usually staffed by part time 'volunteers' and the service may be variable.

I found your report rather interesting, as I understand from POS that there may be a "Memorandum of Understanding" (i.e. a chums carve up) which gives FOS the job of ruling on S32 complaints as opposed to POS. That particular understanding would make no sense to me since S32's are the individual shrapnel we suffer from scuttled occupational pension schemes, so reading that your S32 beef was ruled upon by POS is perhaps a breath of fresh air.

*{my italics}