Refusal by British authorities to sign form for pension

EdInvestor

It would seem that either

1)You will have to get the pension form officially translated into English before they will oblige you and fill it in

or

2)Perhaps you could draft a letter in English for the GP to sign certifying that you are still extant.

You'd have to then translate it back to French of course.

Alfie_E

GPs are no more a state authority than dentists or solicitors. They are not employees of the state. They just happen to get payment from the government, but so do many dentists and solicitors.

I can perfectly understand the line, “haven’t visited the GP in seven years.” If no-one in the surgery had set eyes on you in the previous seven years, how are they supposed to know who you are? The surgery may well feel it’s not their job to verify your identity from any documents you present to them. In fact, many GPs take this as a matter of principle. They want to treat people simply on need, and avoid becoming the financial gatekeeper to the NHS.

Could you not go back to the French agency and say that providing a declaration that you’re alive is no longer something provided by the UK authorities? They must have a contingency. There are places in the world where there is virtually nothing by way of authorities to stamp anything.

citizenessex

Hi Missile,

I had already made an appointment for next week. But now I do not have the form (see previous postings). Also the GP surgery and also the Primary Care Trust (probably after speaking to the surgery) have claimed they cannot verify I am alive even though GPs and the Primary Care Trust are informed if a patient dies not under their watch. And I am on their computers as a patient. So it's not just a question of translation and perhaps not a question of translation at all but that I haven't been to the surgery as a patient for seven years (see also my answer to Alfie below).

Hi Ed,

I've already offered to translate and there are actually plenty of French people living in the town where I live and anyone with basic French can understand the form.

I've also just asked for a "To Whom It May Concern" letter from both the GP and when, the surgery refused, the Local Primary Care Trust. And I wouldn't have expected them to write it in French! I'm pretty sure that somehow if I just sent that, the French authorities wouldn't send it back telling me I need to translate it because none speaks English in their office ...

I now have to wait either for the form to arrive in the post or have to spend time and money phoning France for a new form and start again. Someone has suggest I contacted the Department of Work and Pensions and this seems like the best avenue now.

Hi Alfie,

Thanks for your answer.

At the beginning of the National Health Service, GPs did not want to have tax deducted at source so a scheme was concocted that they would be registered as "self employed" but still receive an NHS occupational pension: that they would be paid in fees by a local committee of the NHS in order to retain self employed status (although still with an occupational pension) and under the NHS regulations would not be allowed to accept fees from patients "whether under the National Health Service Regulations or not".

They are contracted by the local health authority/primary care trust to have NHS patient lists and paid by fees for various services. Someone has also just pointed out to me this refusal to become salaried has meant that if a patient is not ill and does not visit the surgery, that patient is not fee-generating for the GP.

When a patient dies, the GP is informed. Either the GP is the doctor responsible for the care of the patient at the time of death, in which case either the GP or the hospital certifies the death (in both cases the GP will know of the death) or the dead person is identified with their home address and the local primary care trust is contacted and the local primary care trust informs the GP. People do not die without paperwork.

As I have also pointed out, I am still on the computer of the GP and the local primary care trust as well and I am sent circulars regarding the surgery and the local primary care trust, so both the GP surgery and the trust are well aware that I am alive. Which is all the document is asking.

There is registration. Which is why I also mentioned the Shipman enquiry which picked up on the fact that the health authority is supposed to monitor GP lists and did not pick up on the fact that there were multiple sudden deaths. Although in my case they had received no documentation that I was dead (unlike with the Shipman victims where the authority knew that many people had died suddenly and even local people were calling him "Dr Death".).

If you can tell me where I can find a state solicitor nearby I will go to him or her. As I have said, the local council only has an office for information only.

It was the French authorities who suggested, when I phoned up, that I should see the GP since GPs also sign for passports in the UK. This is not something I have done off my own bat. If what you say about documents is true, GPs do not seem to have the same principles when it comes to passports.

I'm afraid it is not true that British authorities as a whole will not verify that I am still alive. They would but there is nothing locally which is what the French authorities expect. The French authorities know that there are offices for the registration of death in the Uk and that state authorities in the UK do liaise.

The French Embassy is not local to me or I would already have gone.

However someone has suggested to me contacting the Department of Work and Pensions and asking it what I should do, which seems the most constructive suggestion.

missile

I really think that OP needs to take a step back. It really is not the GPs or indeed anyone elses responsibility to help you out. You need to help them, if you want to move forward.

You may be fluent in French, but would you sign a form you could not understand?

EdInvestor

citizenessex wrote: »

Obviously according to the French authority mindset you go to the local mairie or police station where you are registered.

Perhaps you should draw their attention to the English mindset, as demonstrated by the requirements for certification of the photo required for obtaining a British passport, which has to be authenticated by a "professional person" such as a doctor, dentist, solicitor, barrister, director of ltd company, pharmacist with a degree (!) MP, judge, police officer, nurse or civil servant.

Got any friends who would qualify?

Of course with passport photos it's a requirement to have known the person for 2 years, which might perhaps be a bit of a problem with official UK types - though that's not a requirement in your case.

Toothsmith

To enter French Cyclosportive events, I need my Dr to write a quick note letting the organisers know that I am likely to get to the finish line without unduly troubling the medical sevices!

I book an appointment, explain what I need, he writes it out I pay about £13.

Job done.

I don't mess about ringing up to ask receptionists and practice managers all about the possibilities, and whys and wherefors.

Just book an appointment with your Dr, use the 10 mins to explain what you need face to face, and pay him the few quid it will cost you. He might even enjoy 10 mins of chat and not have to think of a 'cure' for once.

Unfortunately, now you've flagged yourself up with the receptionists, the simple route may be much more difficult.

Good luck.

citizenessex

The uncompleted form did arrive today in the post -- envelope stamped 18th July, 7 pm. I had phoned up in the morning seven days after I dropped the form off. So it was not posted on 13th July as I was told by GP surgery staff.

Hopefully the Dept of Work and Pensions will now come up trumps. What a palaver about nothing -- first we have registration and then it is ignored ...

mrbnewc1

Hi

I would contact the International Pension Centre, part of the Department for Work and Pensions, telephone 0191 2187777. I'm sure they will have regular contact with foreign authorities and should be able to say yes or no more less immediately to signing it for you. They open at 8 on Monday morning.

Good luck!

Mrbnewc1