Parking Eye - Letter Before County Court Claim

meanmrmustard

Hi,
I know this has been discussed numerous times on various threads but I wanted to start my own to seek advice on the best course of action.
I received a parking charge notice from Parking Eye in June 2013. I then received several reminders to pay the fine, which I ignored (rightly or wrongly)
The other day I received a Letter Before County Court Claim which set the alarm bells ringing. Having read through a lot of good advice on here - in particular Daisy's I have drafted an acknowledgement letter below. I am still within the 14 day limit. Is it also worth sending a letter to Morrison's which is the car park I was in?

Dear Sirs

Re: LETTER BEFORECOUNTYCOURTCLAIMDATED xxxx

I am writing to acknowledge receipt of the above letter.

First of all I would like to state that at I have not once receivedfrom you any correspondence on the subject of Parking on Private Land Appeals (POPLA).It makes sense to comply with the Practice Direction’s requirement to referthis matter to the appropriate form of Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR)which in this case is POPLA.


Having thoroughly read through the Practice Direction – Pre Action Conduct Inotice the above letter does notcomply with all points. Please can you send me a FULLY COMPLIANT Letter BeforeCounty Court Claim so that I can begin to deal with my own obligations underthe Practice Direction.

I refer you to Annex A paragraph 2 of the Practice Direction (attached) andwould kindly request that you follow each individual step when sending me therevised Letter Before Claim.

At this stage I would like to remind you of the Court's powers to applysanctions for non-compliance with the Practice Direction under Para 4, and Iexpect to receive a fully compliant Letter BeforeClaimwithin 14 days. If you do not send me a fully compliant Letter BeforeClaimas requested, I will seek the assistance of the court.

Finally I would also ask that you do me the courtesy of reading and replying tothis letter.Please note, if I receive a generic template letter which does notaddress my requests for information, I shall copy the correspondence to the SolicitorsRegulation Authority and ask it to investigate your breach of the Principlesset out in the SRA Handbook version 8, published on 1st October 2013.

Yours Faithfully
xxxxx

meanmrmustard

Apologies for the different fonts, it was a copying and pasting error :embarasse

meanmrmustard

Sorry for bumping this thread but I don't want to 'hijack' other people's questions. Can someone explain whether I should have raised a POPLA first of all before posting this letter?
I am aware there are template letters for POPLA so I should have no problem finding those. however my concern is, as this offence is over a year old now, am I too late for POPLA?
Thanks

Redx

you are too late for POPLA unless you managed to get PE to issue a popla code that is valid from the day issued, for 28 days

I cannot see PE giving you this code unless a judge directs them to do so, so in this case you are too late, at the moment, so cannot use popla , yet

if you manage to get popla as an ADR in the LBCC letter exchange, or if you get the judge to direct ADR by popla, only then will you get a POPLA code to use at POPLA , from PE

ALL THIS IS EXPLAINED IN THE NEWBIES THREAD BY COUPON-MAD, AS ARE MOST IF NOT ALL TOPICS

a search of the forum using the search box and search words also yields good info from those already doing it or about to do it, so always check for previous, as you are not the first and wont be the last either

meanmrmustard

Okay so I will check again through these newbie threads. Thank you.
So it sounds like this is likely to go to court as you mention the dreaded word 'Judge'.
I wish I had come on these threads again sooner! The last time I checked (a couple of years ago) the advice people, and Watchdog, were giving was IGNORE these parking notices.
I now know this was bad advice, but it's my fault for not checking upated cases :sad:

The_Deep

You might also like to bring this to the attention of the Local Trading Standards Department, (the Council, not Consumer Direct who are useless). If this is not harassment I do not know what is.

meanmrmustard

PE are certainly determined. I moved house late last year AND changed my vehicle...not because of this parking fine! :laugh:
They eventually found me at my new address and so the pestering continues!
I'm determined not to give in though. These companies are no different to the scum bag clampers.

Redx

pardon me if I got this wrong but you titled this thread as being about the pre-court LBCCC from PE letters. which you rebut using the letters and info from here including lazydaisy`s letters

although I mentioned the judge, I mentioned it if you fail at the LBCCC and received an MCOL, because CM clearly states trying to get a popla code and popla adjudication as an ADR

basically you require ADR , and in PE cases that is POPLA

the newbies thread tells people its never too late to appeal (unless court papers have ensued)

so you should have appealed to PE and asked for ADR by popla (this is usually the template letter when done in good time of the pcn arriving)

you are at the LBCCC stage, so again in your letters you would be asking for ADR by POPLA and then doing so if they gave you a popla code

assuming they issue an MCOL, you would still be asking for ADR by POPLA, but the chances are PE wont agree to this unless the judge directs it, which is why you ask the court to consider ADR by POPLA

the point being you want ADR by popla, all the time, anytime, as soon as, no question

how you may get this is explained above

but you took my words out of context, I never said or inferred it would go to court, I hoped you would sort this out in the LBCCC letter exchange , possibly by PE issuing a popla code

if they issue an MCOL, that is the court stages, although it starts off with another letter exchange, its not an automatic court appearance

as you have been a member here for longer than me, I do agree with your statement you should have checked on here much sooner, like I did 12 months ago

meanmrmustard

I sent an appeal email (through their website) to PE round about the time I sent this original Acknowledgement Letter to them.

Okay I have had a reply to my Acknowledgement Letter back from ParkingEye now. To tell you the truth I am a little bit worried and I would appreciate some assistance.

I don't have any of their previous correspondence except for the LBCC. I am thinking now that I should have kept hold of it. Am I within my rights to ask them for it again? I don't have to give them a reason why I don't have it do I?

Anyway the reply letter. I will pick out the main points and try to refrain from just typing out the whole thing:

They began by saying that they have sent me correspondence to this charge in June this year - exact wording is "PE strongly believes that, on the balance of probability, the attached correspondence was delivered and received in the normal manner."

They then went on to say - The Letter Before Claim also explained why ParkingEye, due to your inaction, are now unable to refer this matter to POPLA. However we also explained that we would remain open to alternative ADR if legal action was taken.

Because I had not made an appeal to PE within the timescale (28 days?) they cannot issue a POPLA code. They don't consider POPLA to be a suitable method of ADR at this stage, especially as I have failed to engage with the appeals process prior to this case being processed for further action.

The next part:

We believe our Letter Before County Court Claim is fully compliant with the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct and all the relevant information pertaining to this case has previously been provided.

The only information I had received previously were the Parking Charge notices which I no longer have. Is this the 'relevant information' they're talking about?

You state that you were not the driver of the vehicle at the material time of the Parking Event....

This part baffles me. I have never stated anything of the sort. I have been careful not to provide any mitigation as advised on these threads.

The next part goes on to say that:

The parking charges issued for and on behalf of the landowners are levied on the basis of a contract with the motorist, set out via the signage at the site. The signage sets out the conditions under which a motorist is authorised to park, and that a parking charge will be payable, if the conditions are not met.
In reference to your belief that no contract was entered into by yourself it is the strong belief held by ParkingEye that a contract was entered into.

Reasons being:

• The terms and conditions are on the signage which is visible, clear and appropriately located. I 'cannot now choose that I do not wish to be bound by these.'
• A reasonable grace period is in operation in each car park so that the motorist may study the smaller text and if they don't wish to be bound by the terms and conditions they are able to leave the site.

There is another interesting paragraph stating that the loss claimed in their LBCC is in line with the guidelines set out by the BPA. Their charge is not punitive and set on the strong commercial justification for charges of this nature. The charge is proportionate to PE's losses, and calculated using their company records (which are publicly available). The charges have been worked out in conjunction with the landowner and approved and prescribed by BPA. They don't believe that it would be proportionate to supply their calculations relating to Parking Charges at this time. It should be noted that it is commonly held that any pre-estimate of loss need only be rough and ready.

They finish with information saying that I will need to provide valid evidence indicating that I did not break the terms and conditions stipulated on the signage and they have put the charge on hold for 14 days to allow me to do this.

Or pay the £85 charge....

What should I do now? They are still not following the Practice Direction because they have failed to provide an explanation of how the £85 has been calculated as stated in Para 2.1 (5).

Even though they have told me that I am in possession of the relevant documents (I assume they are talking about the Parking Charges) I believe I should still be able to receive copies of them.

Redx

might be worth reading similar threads like this one https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4961132

Coupon-mad

Yep - another template as expected - so now you go back to the 'LBCCC Fightback' thread and go for another letter back (email is better as it costs you nothing):

[EMAIL="enforcement@parkingeye.co.uk"]enforcement@parkingeye.co.uk[/EMAIL]

Other letters are discussed in the LBCCC Fightback thread, as is the fact POPLA is suitable and the 28 days is their own imposed ADR time limit. EU Law coming in next year will dictate ADR has to be available for a year - pretty sure I posted about it in the LBCCC sticky thread fairly recently.

Also is this a retail park with a Manager or CEO you can send a strong complaint to about this harassment? Loads of landowners cancel PE cases every week on here. You say it's Morrisions so complain to the CEO of Morrisons - the details and email address are clearly set out in the 'Successful Complaints about PPCs' sticky thread along with loads of examples of complaints that worked. Don't take no for an answer and don't leave any letter without a robust email response - this is your month to avoid a court case. Seize the chance.