Go straight to County court, Do not pass Popla Appeal!

Transporter_2

Hi,

After received several extortionate demands for money for overstaying 15mins in a free retail shopping car park, I foolishly ignored all the letters based on the advise I was given the year before.

A couple of days ago i received a 'Claim Form' from County Court (Northampton) requesting £175, from Parkingeye Ltd.

I have contacted the retailer but was told they can't do anything about it.

Just completed the acknowledgement of service, and need some help writing my defence.

I have read all the links in post #5 of the NEWBIES thread and got a copy of the Parking Pranksters Guide.

I have a few questions :
Do I have to enter 2 defences?
i) skeletal one first - do I do this with the AOS ? i.e. within 14 days?
ii) then the full ? within 28 days/ or 14 days before hearing date.?

I plan on submitting the following main points for my skeletal defence, any thoughts before it goes?

a. ParkingEye are not the landowner,
b. As this was a free car park, there is no consideration from the driver to ParkingEye
c. In the event ParkingEye claim they are charging for breach of contract, the charge cannot be a true pre-estimate of loss.
d. I believe that ParkingEye are in breach of the Unfairness in Consumer Contract Regulations 1999 (UTCCR):
d. The signage is not sufficient to create a contract between ParkingEye and the motorist.
e. The registered keeper was not driving the vehicle on the day. The NTK served was not compliant with POFA 2012 and therefore the keeper cannot be held liable. Only the driver can be held liable.

Will add a paragraph/reference to re-direct to popla as well.

My full defence will be something along the lines of Parking Pranskters example, but will post before submitting.

If someone could just review and let me know if this is along the right lines.

Thank you.

The_Slithy_Tove

Only submit defence points you know are valid. E.g. is the NtK really non-compliant?


Anyway, complain to the store again, or whoever owns the car park (if it's a car park shared amongst many stores). Be firm with them - there's everything they can do if they don't want a p****d off customer. Draw their attention to PE's abuse of the code of practice they signed up to in not giving a grace period, which they should have done. Be polite, but firm. Don't take no for an answer. Escalate as necessary.

Coupon-mad

ParkingEye's NTK letters are usually compliant regarding a free car park, I would say. They identify the creditor, they use the wording from paragraph 9, etc. and they normally post them in time for a recipient to get them by day 15 as well. What makes you think yours is not compliant?

Good idea to ask for POPLA instead - then you write and ask again once you've got it past N180 Directions Questionnaire stage, to our local court.

I have a few questions :
Do I have to enter 2 defences?
i) skeletal one first - do I do this with the AOS ? i.e. within 14 days?
ii) then the full ? within 28 days/ or 14 days before hearing date.?

You do not submit the skeleton defence with the AOS, no. You do the AOS within 14 days of service and then follow it with the defence within 28 days of service of the papers (i.e. not later than 33 days of the date on the court paperwork).

You can then send the person who signed the Court papers (Rachel Ledson at PE?) a letter called a 'Part 18 request' demanding full particulars, i.e. list what you need to see, such as all signage photos they intend to rely upon, a list of the case law they intend to rely on, a copy of the landowner contract (not a redacted version) so you can make an informed decision about their locus standi, etc. Anything you want to see nice & early, really, ask for it now as that will help you to defend it.

Your full evidence submission to PE and the local court is for much later, once you get allocated a hearing date - sometimes has to be earlier than 14 days before; depends on the Judge I think. The hearing date letter will tell you your 'filing date' as Defendant. Start preparing your exhibits now such as transcripts of important/persuasive/binding Appeal cases like Thurlow and also McCafferty and any of a FEW PE small claims decisions which mirror your PE case (not too many and nothing that doesn't have a transcript). And case law about signage such as stuff the Prankster recommends, Lord Denning's cases maybe as I mentioned here:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/65878795#Comment_65878795

Your evidence for the hearing should be in Times New Roman font with 1.5 line spacing to be traditional and keep the Judge onside - maybe even taken down to the Court in person in a small plastic file or ring binder, all numbered and clear and as concise as you can make it (not pages and pages like PE!).

Transporter_2

hi,

Thank you for the reply.

ParkingEye's NTK letters are usually compliant regarding a free car park, I would say. They identify the creditor,

This is probably just my wrong understanding of it but reading around - Is not the creditor the landowner? This is not on the NTK so is that not compliant?

Anyway sent a couple of emails to CEO/customer services etc, and actually got a reply. they've sent the details to the store to see if they can "help" with the issue. So a possible result, but I don't belive it till I see it in writing.

If anybody can give a little help in writing a strongly worded letter to try and convince them to Cancel/object to the landowner using ParkingEye, it would be appreciated.

Points I have so far :-
- The size of charge is disproportionate to the breach (e.g. is it fair to charge £100 for overstaying by 10 minutes in a free car park?).

- They have been known NOT to cancel tickets for people claiming genuine mitigating circumstances, as you can imagine this can cause further distress.

I do wish to request that you review the management company in place to deal with car parking at your stores. If this cannot be, I would personnlly like to complain to the current landowners about this situation. If you could provide me with a contact adress,
- I would like to make them aware that they are driving customers away from their premises.
- I can send all the letter's ParkingEye has been sending me. I am extremely distressed by this situation. I don't see why as a customer I have to be suffer from this situation.


thanks.

Coupon-mad

No, the creditor is ParkingEye because they identify themselves as such with that word somewhere. Their NTK letters in a free car park haven't been spotted as having a wording flaw or omission (it's different as regards a pay and display car park IMHO, where there is an issue with the wording).

As regards complaint letters, have a look at the examples in the sticky thread all about successful complaints. It's in the stickies collated by Crabman, third thread from the top. You want top look at 'Successful complaints about PPCs' and read several links in post #1 of it, which includes PE cases cancelled after court papers were issued. Also in post #3 of it, I think I linked some example ranting complaints that I wrote for people last year including one to the CEO of Morrisons that was all about ParkingEye (albeit a disability discrimination case as the person should have been allowed longer).

Transporter_2

OK, thanks for clearing that up, I'll make a note to leave it out.

Complaint letters - yes thanks read those, those are the ones I used to formulate the original complaint letter, which got a response. I now wanted one to follow up after that, to let them know they should stop using ParkingEye. A free car park , is a free car park, they should let people use as they want.
I'll read around some more.
Thank you.

Coupon-mad

Have you seen this thread?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4996501

Don't write letters. Try the daily email complaint approach I suggested to that poster - keep going until they crawl back under their stone and withdraw any request for you to send them money for the Christmas party. Become a thorn in the side of Morrisons and PE and get it cancelled.