Lowell/Lloyds help

sourcrates

No, its not legit, there are no prescribed terms at all, there is nothing stating the credit limit, nothing telling you the interest rate applicable, amount of credit, how its to be repaid etc etc, totally unenforceable agreement in my opinion.

Chewbert

This the terms and conditions, headed 'Bank's copy'.

xxxx://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy246/themaestro8/Mobile%20Uploads/image-1.jpg

What is my next course of action?

sourcrates

OP, your half way there with Lowell anyway, write and tell them this agreement is lacking in the prescribed terms applicable to your agreement, and does not comply with your CCA request, also it is most likely a court would rule the agreement unenforceable due to not having the prescribed terms on the agreement.
Lowell fold very easily in these circumstances :beer:

Chewbert

So it's definitely not acceptable? Unsure what I'm actually meant to write to them, is there a template letter? I was reading that most agreements are enforceable now due to a new case going through?

sourcrates

Chewbert wrote: »

So it's definitely not acceptable? Unsure what I'm actually meant to write to them, is there a template letter? I was reading that most agreements are enforceable now due to a new case going through?

In 2007 the law changed closing the loophole so to speak, so any agreement dated after 2007 cant be challenged on unenforceability alone, but, any agreement prior to 2007, like yours, had a lot of the prescribed terms, as I mentioned before, missing from the actual agreement document, this meant that it did not comply with the consumer credit act 1974 and therefore would most likely be unenforceable in court, lets be clear, only a court can define whether a document is enforceable or not, but as those terms are missing from your agreement, the chances are if it went to court, they would find in your favour, now Lowell know this, but bank on the fact that you don't, so you write back saying something like this :




Dear sir/madam,


ref : xxx xxxxx xxxxxx




Thank you for your letter dated xx/xx/xxxx, the contents of which have been noted.
On xx/xx/xxxx I sent you a CCA request for an account you claim is owed by myself. As you are aware the account dates from 2004, To fully comply with my CCA request the documents you must supply me with must contain ALL of the prescribed terms applicable to an account of this nature, my name, address, signature, the credit limit applicable to the account, the interest rate payable, how and when to make repayment etc etc.
As you can see a large number of these "prescribed terms" are missing from this document, which was common practice at the time, and makes the account likely to be unenforceable.


As you know only a court can rule on the enforceability or not of a specific account, but with these terms missing from this document, it is likely that a court would rule in my favour in this matter, and as such I will not be making any offer of payment to you.
I await your response.
regards.


tell them straight, don't be afraid of them, its likely they will fold quiet easily on this.

Chewbert

Thanks for that Sourcrates. When you mention the 'prescribed terms' and what they are. This is what is on it
Name, Address at the time, Signature are on the front page headed 'Credit card application and agreement'

On the second page headed, 'Terms and conditions - banks copy'
These conditions are effective from 1st October 2002.
It has......
Credit Limit - We set a credit limit and can change it. We will notify you of the limit and any changes.
We set the payment date - it is normally 25 days from the date of your statement but may vary.
Rates of interest and APR's - All these rates are variable. These APR's do not take any variation into account.
It then gives a list of what the rates are for different cards.

Sorry for all the questions but is that not enough and they must be specifically for my account?

matttye

I would think that so long as the credit agreement makes reference to terms of business being attached and an appropriate box for you to agree to the terms of business, that any terms within those terms of business can be taken as being on the credit agreement itself.

No idea whether they need to be specific to your account or not - hopefully sourcrates will know.

sourcrates

The court cannot make an enfocement order in respect of a pre-6th April 2007 credit card agreement unless a document containing all the prescribed terms was signed by the debtor (section 127(3) CCA 1974).

The Regulations provide that the agreement must contain a prescribed term relating to the credit limit which must state:-

1. the credit limit; or

2. the manner in which the credit limit will be determined; or

3. that there is no credit limit.

None of the credit card agreements I have seen state the credit limit or that there is no credit limit and they all say that the credit limit will be determined by the creditor and notified to the debtor.

It is clear from paragraph 8 of Schedule 1 to the Agreements Regulations that the statement that the credit limit will be determined by the creditor is not within the requirement for a statement of the manner in which the credit limit will be determined.

The agreement, therefore, does not contain the prescribed term relating to the credit limit and so does not contain all the prescribed terms. As the agreement does not contain all the prescribed terms, the court is prevented from enforcing it by section 127(3) CCA 1974.


For your document to be legal, it must state the credit limit, and ALL of the prescribed terms MUST be on the same document and SIGNED by the debtor, this is clearly not the case so , in my humble opinion, your agreement would be unenforceable in court !!

Chewbert

Thank you very much Sourcrates and Matttye. You're very knowledgeable people. I shall get that letter drawn up and sent off. See what they come back with.

sourcrates

Chewbert wrote: »

Thank you very much Sourcrates and Matttye. You're very knowledgeable people. I shall get that letter drawn up and sent off. See what they come back with.

Sometimes its the smallest of details that work in your favour, DCA`s operate on the basis that the consumer knows nothing about the law, fore armed is forewarned I believe is the saying, good luck with it, let us know what they come back with as we may be able to advise further.