Paying pension money care home no POA

roxy28

Uncle paying care home fees for his dads dementia home ( they lived together until the care home move 12 months ago. They are always in order, but he knows he does not do it the correct way, the state pension is paid to his account no problem.With no POA he has no access to his dads bank account, for which he needs access to his dads work pension,the LA fund the rest.
There are 2 direct debits in place for the home they lived in (uncle still does) so they are left active, so uncle pays the equvilent fees out of his own money to add to the state pension and pays the right amount each month.

No gain is made for any party, its like dads direct debits pay uncle bills and uncle pays dads needed work pension equivelent and a little bit more out of his own money. Its all done for convenience and nothing else.

How bad would this be looked on as not being the correct procedure.His dad does not have capacity anymore.

xylophone

Father has his own bank account into which his state pension and occupational pension are paid?

The state pension goes to the care home via a DD?

This is not enough to pay his assessed contribution to the fees?

There are two other direct debits on this account which fund what? Uncle's power/water/Council tax etc?

Uncle pays the equivalent value of the two DDs plus another amount to the care home from his own money on the basis that when his father dies, he will be repaid because he will inherit whatever is left in his father's bank account?

Presumably Father's occupational pension was declared to the LA when he applied for funding?

Does the fact that the amount of capital in Father's bank account is increasing have any effect on the LA funding?

Father no longer has capacity to control his bank account so that were the amount of the DD's on the account to increase, he could not be regarded as having given consent?

The situation is irregular and questions might be asked?

https://www.gov.uk/become-deputy/overview might be worth a look.

roxy28

xylophone wrote: »

Father has his own bank account into which his state pension and occupational pension are paid?

The state pension goes to the care home via a DD?

This is not enough to pay his assessed contribution to the fees?

There are two other direct debits on this account which fund what? Uncle's power/water/Council tax etc?

Uncle pays the equivalent value of the two DDs plus another amount to the care home from his own money on the basis that when his father dies, he will be repaid because he will inherit whatever is left in his father's bank account?

Presumably Father's occupational pension was declared to the LA when he applied for funding?

Does the fact that the amount of capital in Father's bank account is increasing have any effect on the LA funding?

Father no longer has capacity to control his bank account so that were the amount of the DD's on the account to increase, he could not be regarded as having given consent?

The situation is irregular and questions might be asked?

https://www.gov.uk/become-deputy/overview might be worth a look.

State pension paid to uncle, works pension his dads account, care home fees always paid to care home via LA.
All assessment done and told the amount needed to pay = state pension + percentage of work pension then, he is left with £23 for toiletries etc, uncle buys these out of his money as well.

So it is irregular as you say, but his savings are well below £14,250 so it would take a long time to raise to higher levels,as his work pension is quite small .
It really is not for any gain, it just works well albeit not the way it should be, but say again his dad does not loose out, and uncle has a standing order to his dads account.

xylophone

State pension paid to uncle,

Because this is what Father requested before he became ill?

xylophone

uncle has a standing order to his dads account.

For what purpose?

roxy28

xylophone wrote: »

Because this is what Father requested before he became ill?

Appointee, dwp agreed to pay it to uncle so care home fees can be paid

roxy28

xylophone wrote: »

For what purpose?

To be able to pay any increase in DD as you mentioned earlier,back to his account.

Also dementia at a very advanced stage now, so could be sooner than later, but told its never 100% certain but likely now, so it is draining uncle quite a lot now.

xylophone

So Uncle receives Father's pension, pays the pension into his Father's account (which Uncle cannot then cannot access) and the money in Father's account pays Uncle's bills via the pre-existing Direct Debits?

The whole of Father's assessed contribution is paid from Uncle's bank account to the LA so that the LA can pay the care home.

Father's pocket money is provided from Uncle's bank account?

roxy28

xylophone wrote: »

So Uncle receives Father's pension, pays the pension into his Father's account (which Uncle cannot then cannot access) and the money in Father's account pays Uncle's bills via the pre-existing Direct Debits?

The whole of Father's assessed contribution is paid from Uncle's bank account to the LA so that the LA can pay the care home.

Father's pocket money is provided from Uncle's bank account?

My uncle recieves his father pension, pays this and the portion of works pension out of his own pocket to the carehome via LA, so the DD from his fathers account help him towards the work pension amount he pays from his own pocket.

atush

You are in a bit of a muddle.

All monies should be paid to whoever is paying for the fathers care. If no POA was arranged in time, then you go back to post 2 and look into X's suggestion

https://www.gov.uk/become-deputy/overview

It sounds like his work pension is being paid and not used, but I am not sure due to confusion of above posts. But it is clear that someone (you or uncle) needs to take control of all accts and have things paid direct to care home if need be.

xylophone

As far as I can see, to be strictly correct, what should happen is that Uncle should approach the Office of the Public Guardian and seek to be appointed as Father's Deputy?

Once this is arranged, and Uncle can legally access and control Father's bank account, Uncle should arrange to have Father's State Pension paid to that account and cancel the two DDs that relate to Uncle's house expenses - they can then be set up on Uncle's own account.

Uncle can then arrange the necessary DD/SO from Father's account to the LA to enable the care home fees to be paid, and can draw cash from Father's account to provide Father's pocket money?

This achieves a clear separation between Uncle's financial affairs and those of Father?

This does come at a cost which is explained in the link.