Why Don't Cyclists Use Cycle Lanes....

her_welshness

hugheskevi wrote: »

The Department for Transport advises leaving half a car's width when overtaking cyclists. That is about 1 metre.

Marking a cycle lane can encourage dangerous overtaking, as many drivers will assume that as long as they do not cross the line, they are fine to proceed without reducing speed. That can lead to overtaking at speed with only a few centimetres of paint separating cyclists and cars. But if an overtake is dangerous withouth paint, then it does not become safe simply because a line has been painted on a road.

The width of a bike's handlebars (flat handlebars) is about 60cm. Pedestrians will often be walking at the edge of pavements, so in many places it is not safe to have handlebars over the pavement.

So that leaves 40cm of space between edge of handlebar and the paint. Add to that metals grids (which often are badly put into the road, creating a hole or raised surface you have to go around), pot-holes, painted lines and so forth, and that eats up a few more centimetres.

Which leads to the question how many centimetres is safe. Given the amount of dents that occur between stationary and slow moving vehicles in supermarkets, it seems many drivers are not sufficiently skilled to be judging moves down to a few 10s of centimetres at speed.

If there is no cycle lane there, drivers have to exercise judgement rather than assuming as long as they stay the right side of the line the pass is safe.

Vauxhall Bridge in London has an excellent example of this sort of dangerous infrasturcture, encouraging dangerous overtaking.

Excellent post.

I have now cut out Vauxhall Bridge from my commute home, I use Lambeth Bridge and then some back streets back towards Camberwell. That lane on Vauxhall Bridge is probably one of the most misleading 'cycle' lanes that exists in London.

I think this whole discussion, interesting as it is, lies in the overriding belief from the OP that drivers should have the right to the roads over other people who do use them. As the majority of us who cycle know, cycle lanes are at best below par. If they are useable then I will cycle on them, if only to demonstrate that a) it is a cycle route/part of the London Cycle Network b) if I'm cycling on them you can too.

Most of my 11 mile commute is on main roads and it is rather direct route, I cycle past hundreds of cars who are stuck in traffic - I feel a bit sorry for them at times!

KidLawnMoe

esuhl wrote: »

Like at this roundabout, you mean?

Wow, that is just dreadful. Definitely one to bypass if possible. If not, I'd be sticking right in the middle of the main driving lane and being very aware about being undertaken.

Hanky_Panky

Where I live in Milton Keynes we have an excellent Redway system designed well away from the roads to take pedestrians and cyclists. Cyclists are encouraged to ring their bell when coming up behind pedestrians to allow them to move to one side so the cyclist can go past. It really is Nirvana for the cyclist...



...actually no !

Great when out with the family on a slow tootle around admiring the views but almost a torture when out trying rack up a few miles. Constant stop/start to cross over roads. Bumping up and down kerbs (not good on skinny tyres!). Pedestrians mouthing off at you because you have had the nerve to ring your bell at them I've even been spat at once ! Add in winter ice and they're a death trap.

Me - I get out of the gridway system as quickly as possible and escape to the country, bliss !

silverwhistle

hugheskevi wrote: »

Cyclists injured/killed by left turning lorries really have only themselves to blame.

Hang on! You don't mean that really? You've never been left hooked by a vehicle overtaking you and then turning left across your path? Or been shouted at because you're taking the primary position to avoid exactly that?:cool:

lxpeanut

Hanky_Panky wrote: »

Where I live in Milton Keynes we have an excellent Redway system designed well away from the roads to take pedestrians and cyclists.

In Liverpool we have a cycleway that is an old railway line and its similar nice if you want a slow ride but otherwise useless. Mostly because of pedestrians, and worse dogs, who aren't paying any attention to their surroundings meaning you have to slowdown or you will run them over when they wander in front of you. Bikes and pedestrians shouldn't be mixed especially when the bike is doing 20mph. But the council have also fitted barriers to prevent motorbikes using them. These are every few hundred yards in places and at each one you have to dismount to get your bike through. The one advantage is being an ex railway cutting it crosses over or under roads so no junctions to wait at.
.

silverwhistle

Well, I'm glad Altarf is not here at the moment: they don't appear to be a very aware road-user.

What disturbed me from the report quoted above which in turn quoted the inquest:

Ms Tereschenko died "as a result of traumatic road death". Although the driver, Gurpreet Shergill failed to indicate and was talking on a mobile phone at the time, Dr Radcliffe went on to conclude "that nobody is to blame".

Words fail me.

silverwhistle

Just spotted this on The Guardian website:

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/bike-blog/video/2014/jan/16/cycling-london-five-most-difficult-junctions-video

Frugalsod

silverwhistle wrote: »

Well, I'm glad Altarf is not here at the moment: they don't appear to be a very aware road-user.

What disturbed me from the report quoted above which in turn quoted the inquest:



Words fail me.

I agree, it is clear who is at fault.

hugheskevi

silverwhistle wrote: »

Hang on! You don't mean that really? You've never been left hooked by a vehicle overtaking you and then turning left across your path? Or been shouted at because you're taking the primary position to avoid exactly that?:cool:

I'd hoped the context and a video of a truck overtaking and immediately turning across a cyclist clarifed the intent

Personally I've had many left-hooks of varying severity. Only one of which was extremely dangerous - I don't think the woman driving the car at any point realised what she did, despite a complete lock-up of my (fortunately) very recently adjusted brakes and coming within an inch of contact.

Never had anyone shout at me for being in primary to avoid being left hooked, but I usually cycle quite quickly and am in heavy traffic on a lot of the journey, so overtakes from cars are quite limited.

Just spotted this on The Guardian website:

http://www.theguardian.com/environme...unctions-video

I always feel sorry for poor old Vauxhall Cross. Cited in every example of bad cycling facilities, but the folk who designed it did think about cyclists and put in some good stuff. I barely use any cycle facilities on my route, but use the dedicated cycling routes on Vauxhall in both directions - on the way in cycllists can cut straight through the centre past the bus station and on my way back you can skip from road to cycle path to by-pass a red light and back on to the road again, most convenient (though not ideal for the pedestrians). Add to that some well placed and very useful ASZs which put you to the front of the traffic and any fast cyclist should be able to hold that position around the roundabout, so for fast, experienced cyclists familiar with the layout I think it is a very enjoyable junction. Admittedly for less experienced cyclists who don't spot the concealed entrances to the cycle lanes (which are unusably slow anyway) it is terrible though.

Words fail me.

I was quite struck by this cyclist's death. The lady cyclist was killed when a man who was already banned from driving and over the drink drive limit, crossed double white lines to overtake a vehicle and in doing so hit an oncoming cyclist. He then fled the scene, leaving the woman to die.

The maximum penalty available was 14 years in jail, he got 6. I wonder what you have to do to get the maximum...

Frugalsod

hugheskevi wrote: »

The maximum penalty available was 14 years in jail, he got 6. I wonder what you have to do to get the maximum...

I think you have to do unmentionable things to the Queens corgis at the same time.