Employer refuses to provide written particulars

Azmataz

As the title specifies! :eek: There is no written contract of employment or staff handbook to refer to.

I know that employers are obliged to provide written particulars to workers within two months of them starting.

When that doesn't happen, other than taking the issue to tribunal, are there any repercussions for employers who refuse to issue written particulars? What can, if anything, enforce them to provide such?

I've been working at this company since 2011 and have recently had unilateral but unclear changes made to my contract of employment. They won't give me written particulars, so I don't know fully what my new contract incorporates. I sent them a letter saying that I reserve my rights and that I'm working under protest but that was ignored and I'm now treading water - nothing is happening.

What say you, wise MSEers? Other than ''Rather you than me!'' :doh: Any advise please?

Savvy_Sue

I believe that if you take an employer to tribunal and win, then the fact that you did not get written particulars can be used to enhance your award.

But you'll notice the 'if ... then' clause in that sentence.

PasturesNew

I've rarely had written particulars of jobs I've done over the years!

Takeaway_Addict

you can't take them to a tribunal for not recieving the written particulars on the own...so basically, you can do nothing.

If you are not given any information then you have to presume statutory

Savvy_Sue

Takeaway_Addict wrote: »

you can't take them to a tribunal for not recieving the written particulars on the own...so basically, you can do nothing.

If you are not given any information then you have to presume statutory

Both these points are true and I should have mentioned them. The second can be particularly useful as sometimes employers don't know what statutory entitlement is.

Also note 'custom and practice' can be useful, but in the end, you generally either do what the employer requires or find another one.

getmore4less

The contract can be varied from statutory even without written particulars.

verbal greements(allthough not eay to verify) could be things discused in interview or changes made later.

Writen terms in offer lettters or acceptance letters or other things like memos, emails.

Custom and practice.( a common one here may be hours and shifts) contract says one thing but in relaity you do something else all the time.

One thing to do is collect all the evidence you can for anything that may be part of the contract, keep every writen comunication, make notes of meetings, for verbal changes it is a good idea to try to get written versions, so an email along the lines of following the discussion yesterday can you confirm that ..... is now in place, or I dont quite understand can you clarify....

A good starting point for the sorts of things you need to look for is
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1996/18/part/I

Azmataz

Takeaway_Addict wrote: »

If you are not given any information then you have to presume statutory

Yes, I'm presuming statutory for things like holiday entitlement, sick leave, notice etc. However, it's when I'm required to work that's the main issue.

Although I've been told that I still have set hours under the new contract, 50% of the time (I calculated it) I've gone in to find myself scheduled for/expected to commit to longer hours (+4) that day too, which is outside of those set. Subsequently I don't know for sure when/if I'll be required for extra hours ahead of time.

Previously, I was always given plenty of notice and asked if I could provide cover. Now the expectation appears to be that I'll do extra hours at short notice (that same day) without being asked. However, they refuse to say if that's part of my contract or not.

Is there another way I can pin them down on the hours that they require me?

Savvy_Sue

Right, you've been there two years (you say you started work there in 2011, so don't do anything rash if it's quite that long yet!)

Are you in a union? If not, join one now. http://www.worksmart.org.uk/unionfinder/

Do you have other colleagues who are similarly affected?

Do you work full-time or part-time? Are / were your working days generally the same length, or variable? Are there reasons why the cover is needed which could or should have been anticipated? Are YOU able to predict when this is going to happen?

Do you have caring responsibilities?

What would happen if you said "sorry, no, I cannot stay an additional four hours today as I have made arrangements to do something which I cannot now change."

Can you suggest a solution to your employer?

I think in an ideal world, I'd want to present a combined solution to your employer from everyone affected, along the lines of "we realise that cover has to be provided, however we would like to have notice of when we have to work additional hours, and our suggestion is ..."

But I realise this isn't an ideal world.

ValHaller

Azmataz wrote: »

Yes, I'm presuming statutory for things like holiday entitlement, sick leave, notice etc. However, it's when I'm required to work that's the main issue.

Although I've been told that I still have set hours under the new contract, 50% of the time (I calculated it) I've gone in to find myself scheduled for/expected to commit to longer hours (+4) that day too, which is outside of those set. Subsequently I don't know for sure when/if I'll be required for extra hours ahead of time.

Previously, I was always given plenty of notice and asked if I could provide cover. Now the expectation appears to be that I'll do extra hours at short notice (that same day) without being asked. However, they refuse to say if that's part of my contract or not.

Is there another way I can pin them down on the hours that they require me?

In the last resort, it is reasonable that you go home at the time you understood you would be going home when you set out for the shift or within an hour of that time for incidental overtime to complete tasks. If the job is one where cover is required, incidental overtime does not arise.

I have worked jobs where there was a contract for overtime as required, but I have never had overtime imposed at a specified time. If it is imposed at a specified time, then I believe that 24 hours notice minimum is required.

Are you being paid for the extra time? If not, does the overtime take you below NMW?

Azmataz

I’m not yet in a union, but am going to that link after posting this – thanks!!!

My colleagues are not affected as I am because they were already part time: I was full time. The other three full timers bailed when they found out hours were being cut.

Hours for all workers previously were very set – each had particular days and/or shifts which didn't deviate. Essentially I’ve been transferred to shift work now which is something I didn’t do before. The 'extra' work I'm finding that I’m being put down for (the later shift) is easily foreseeable - someone is always needed for it. My days of work remain the same as before - all week days, except my duration in work is half that which it was previously. I get paid by the hour, so I get paid for all time in work.

I’m seeing a pattern emerge - that is for me to pick up extra shifts half the time that I’m in work. Thankfully I don’t have caring responsibilities anymore, as the time between shifts is just nominal enough to not make it feasible to get anywhere/do anything else away from work, except wait for the start of the next.

I kind of feel cornered into doing the extra shifts and feel uneasy about refusing them, especially as I've got nothing verbally or in writing to tell me that this is part of the contract. Wouldn't it make me in breach of contract if I refused to cover?

The solution I asked for was to have the particulars given to me, confirming my hours/work pattern. They just won't commit to confirming my schedule.

Thanks for reading and your advice. Even if I can’t sort anything it’s cathartic for me to type this all out!

Savvy_Sue

OK, it's a shame you're the only person affected. Join a union, check how long they need you to be a member before they'll support you if your employer plays hardball, but meanwhile ...

let me get this straight: you were f/t, your employer reduced your hours but gave nothing in writing? Or nothing in writing about exactly what your hours would be? I'd say this was very good grounds to raise a grievance.

Also, you're paid for all the hours you work, but when you take a week's holiday, do you get your new p/t hours only, or do they base it on an average of the previous 12 (or is it 17?) weeks?

And do you have any definite hours, ie do you always come in at 9 and expect to leave at 2, but sometimes they then ask you to work 3 until 7 as well?

You didn't answer the question about what would happen if you said "sorry, I can't stay today." That's not necessarily one I'd try from a standing start: I might start with "I've noticed you often ask me to work the late shift on Mondays, without telling me beforehand, I've made an appointment for this Monday afternoon so please be aware I won't be able to stay."

Is it generally a good place to work? Do you sense this is one person being ignorant / annoying / incompetent, or a company-wide problem?