Council Tax debt... Help needed, Bailiff involved!!

Tough_Si

Hi guys,

I need some help with a council tax issue that has reared it's ugly head. I owned a property with my ex wife but when we seperated she stayed in the property. I was under the impression at the time that she was paying all the bills but then she just upped and moved out and left me high and dry with a property I couldn't afford.
I handed the keys back to the mortgage company and moved out. The property was then vacant for approx 9-12 months before it was sold.
I have recently been receiving letters for unpaid council tax for this property that basically cover all the time I wasn't in the property and the time that the bank received the keys back.
A bailiff turned up at my property the back end of last month and after much discussion, he handed it back to the debt company (Rossendales) and they requested my income details (which I provided) to set up repayments. They put my account on hold and gave me 7 days to get the info across to them (which I did) and I requested that they contact me once they received my info as I was working away from home and any written notifications wouldn't be received. Anyhow, I had no response until yesterday when a bailiff randomly turned up at my mothers house to seize items to pay this debt off... I spoke to the company to find out what was going on and it appears that the bailiff was instructed to deal with this case within the 7 days that my account was on hold.
The company is now saying I have to deal with the bailiff direct (who is smug, ignorant and quite frankly very intimidating) He's demanding £550 to clear this debt or he will continue turning up at my property. This is very unsettling to me as 1) there's no way I can afford to pay that and 2) I'm not even sure if this is my debt or if it is, then how much I actually owe..
Any advice would be great fully received as I'm really stressed out about it all and I'm not sure what to do??

Thanks

dancingfairy

Well. Do you owe the council tax or not? That seems to be the question. If you own the house jointly it is reasonable for the council to assume you are still living their with your wife. If one of you leaves then I guess they will try and chase whoever is easiest to chase. Did you tell the council you had left? Did you provide another address where you were resident at the time?
Also when you handed the keys back, I don't think this means you are released from your liability. You presumably are still the owner until such time as a court order that the bank/building society have taken control of the building (whether or not you've handed back the keys). Do you know the actual date of repossession? Even if you are still liable during this time you may be able to claim an empty and unfurnished discount.
I think you need to go back to the council and actually speak to someone so you can find out where you stand. Make a complaint if needs be.
Whilst you are trying to resolve this with the council then the bailiffs should put the debt on hold.
You can try and write to the bailiffs, maybe copy them into the letter you are sending to the council and ask they put the account on hold to allow you to sort things out.
In terms of charges and bailiffs actions: They are only allowed to charge for a maximum of 2 visits where they haven't been able to levy. I think the charges are about 42.50 in total. Any other fees may well be ilegal and should be challenged. They can levy on a car so make sure you don't have a car at the property. If they are successful in levying then a) they can take your goods but b) more importantly they can charge a lot more in fees (a couple hundred I think). It is vital you do not let them levy on your car (if you have one). The other way they can levy is if you let them into your house. Do not let them in, not to phone the boss, not to use the toilet, not because they say it's the law. Just don't let them in. They should eventually get bored and hand the debt back to the council.
There is a really useful factsheet on dealing with bailiffs and council tax on the National Debtlines website.
Hope that helps.
df

dancingfairy

The factsheet is here: http://www.nationaldebtline.co.uk/england_wales/factsheet.php?page=02_bailiffs_and_council_tax
Do you live at your mothers address?
Did the bailiffs gain access and levy any goods as the advice will be different if they have.
Did they levy on any items that weren't yours? What did they levy on?
You may need further advice if they have levied goods. Also bear in mind that I believe that the goods now belong to them and therefore can't be disposed of and I think they can break in to recover them. Therefore if they have actually levied you need to make this clear so you can get the right advice.
Best of Luck
df

Tough_Si

Hi DF,
I have spoke to the council because I have disputed the dates they claim the property was in my name, but they have told me that I need to discuss it with the bailiff.
They have not been in the property and nothing has been signed, as for the car, I don't own one so nothing to worry about on that front..

I'm just really confused as to which direction I need to go to resolve the problem?

National_Debtline

Hi Si,

Sorry to learn of the situation. We speak to scores of people every day that have council tax bailiffs chasing them. I can appreciate how concerned you must feel right now.

I cannot stress highly enough that you are actually in a good position as far as the bailiff is concerned. The reason being is that you (or anyone else) has not let them in to the property. You must never do this.

I repeat. You must NEVER do this.

Please keep doors and windows locked and secure. If the bailiff cannot get in to the property they ONLY have two options.

1. To put up with whatever offer of payment you can make to them.
2. To pass the file back to the local authority.

That is it!

This is what you need to do.

1. Please have a read through the fact sheet that our good frined Dancingfairy has posted up. Print it off, go through it with a highlighter pen. Remember that so long as the bailiff doesn't get in, you really do call the shots.
2. Complete a financial statement and make an offer of payment to the bailiff. It's better to do this in writing.
3. Request a breakdown of fees and charges. As already mentioned they can only apply a maximum of £42.50 if they cannot get in. This covers the two visits that they can legitimately charge you for.
4. If the bailiff won't give you the facility to make payments (standing order is best). Keep the money to one side until they actuall pass the file back to the local authority.

Please never pay a bailiff cash. You need a paper trail.

As the car is not yours they cannot take it, if they try and implicate the car please come back and post on this thread - you're welcome to ask as many questions as you need.

You can find some decent budget sheets to print off and fill in here:
http://www.nationaldebtline.co.uk/england_wales/debt_advice.php#5

If you have any questions please do not hesitate to ask.

Best wishes,

David @ NDL.

dancingfairy

The bailiff will only collect the debt (plus their costs) that the council obtained a liability order for. The council are the ones that you owe the alleged debt to. They are the ones who are responsible for the conduct of their agents. Basically overall responsibility lies with the council.
You may need to escalate things and put in a complaint to the council.
df

dancingfairy

National_Debtline_representative wrote: »

Hi Si,

Sorry to learn of the situation. We speak to scores of people every day that have council tax bailiffs chasing them. I can appreciate how concerned you must feel right now.

I cannot stress highly enough that you are actually in a good position as far as the bailiff is concerned. The reason being is that you (or anyone else) has not let them in to the property. You must never do this.

I repeat. You must NEVER do this.

Please keep doors and windows locked and secure. If the bailiff cannot get in to the property they ONLY have two options.

1. To put up with whatever offer of payment you can make to them.
2. To pass the file back to the local authority.

That is it!

This is what you need to do.

1. Please have a read through the fact sheet that our good frined Dancingfairy has posted up. Print it off, go through it with a highlighter pen. Remember that so long as the bailiff doesn't get in, you really do call the shots.
2. Complete a financial statement and make an offer of payment to the bailiff. It's better to do this in writing.
3. Request a breakdown of fees and charges. As already mentioned they can only apply a maximum of £42.50 if they cannot get in. This covers the two visits that they can legitimately charge you for.
4. If the bailiff won't give you the facility to make payments (standing order is best). Keep the money to one side until they actuall pass the file back to the local authority.

Please never pay a bailiff cash. You need a paper trail.

As the car is not yours they cannot take it, if they try and implicate the car please come back and post on this thread. I'm going to keep an eye on it today - you're welcome to ask as many questions as you need.

You can find some decent budget sheets to print off and fill in here:
http://www.nationaldebtline.co.uk/england_wales/debt_advice.php#5

If you have any questions please do not hesitate to ask.

Best wishes,

David @ NDL.

I agree with this but the actual dates/original cost seem to be disputed so I'd do as you suggest once the correct liability has been established.
df

National_Debtline

Oh, and for the record, if you feel that you have a dispute you may wish to wait for the debt to be handed back to the local authority by the bailiff - it will happen at some point.

Do consider writing to the council and requesting their complaints procedure. If they do not try and resolve the dispute you could take the matter up with the Local Government Ombudsman: www.lgo.gov.uk

David.

Ju78

Hi people,

Please can someone give me some advice.
I've dealt with bailiffs before with council tax debt and always paid what they've asked for by the date they've said but this time things are different.
I got home at 8pm last night to find a letter entitled "attendance notice the clearance of goods". I've been really good with my debts recently because I've just started a new job and want everything paid off. This debt to me was new and this is the first letter I've seen regarding this debt.
I phoned the bailiff at 9:30 this morning & left a voicemail. When he phone back I missed it but called straight back. He told me the debt was for 2012 bill (I paid him £330.00 in September, hence thinking I was up to date with my council tax, but apparently that was my 2011 arrears).
He said that he won't accept weekly or monthly instalments but the debt of £449.49 must be paid in full by 17/12/13. I said that I would speak to the council and I'd try to get the money together by the 17th.

I phoned the council. They said the debt was for 2012 and for £284.99. The guy at the council was great and explained that I could speak to head office and ask for a breakdown of the £164.50 worth of charges.

I phoned the main office and the lady tried to put me through to the Baliff but couldn't get through. I said that I just wanted a breakdown of charges. She got quite rude and said that she would have to speak to the bailiff to get permission because it's his case. I asked her if someone could call me back to let me know.

She phoned back after about 15 mins and rudely said "I've spoken to mr .... He said that you've spoken to him today and agreed to pay by the 17th. He's sent you a breakdown of charges and in future you must go through him" it seemed like I had upset the Baliff! So I phoned him direct to try and say that 1. I had agreed to try and pay it, to which his tone changed and he said "well then if you're going to be like that, you've got until Friday" and 2. I was a bit concerned that she said you've sent me the breakdown and I hadn't received it. He got really angry and aggressive and wouldn't let me finish my sentences, just kept shouting to cut me off. Then he turned it around and accused me of being really angry, that he wasn't prepared to talk to me until I had calmed down and he hung up on me. I called him straight back and literally begged him to let me finish a sentence. He didn't like this and continued to be really cross. I explained that when I paid the last lot in September I wasn't working and had to borrow it so it will be really hard to get all if this money together to pay him on dec 17th. I said "what happens if I can't get it all together by this date" he said that I was lucky he's given me until this date because legally he only had to give me 48 hours before he removes my stuff and if I don't pay it, the debt will go back to the council and they will send me to prison. I had a panic attack after I got off the phone to him, I couldn't breathe and I was shaking so much. But I phoned the council back. They gave me a breakdown of his charges: 1st visit £24.50, 2nd visit £18.00, levy £32.00, attendance £90.00.

What I don't understand is how he's done the levy because the letter I got yesterday was the first one. I don't think he's been into the property, there's been no one here to let him in. I 100% have not signed anything. I live in a ground floor flat but if he's done a levy by looking through the window, does it make it invalid? Certain website say I need to be provided with different forms and the only evidence that I've had is the letter I got yesterday.

Another question I have is, if I pay the £284.99 direct to the council on Friday when I get paid, and pay the £42.50 in fees to him for the visits, where do I stand. If the debt goes back to the council, I've already paid the debt and they can get a warrant for committal to prison because I'm not refusing to pay, as I will have already paid.

I've got an appointment with CAB on sat to discuss this but the advice that people have given on here is wonderful and I just hope someone can advise me too? Thank you in advance

**sebt from my phone. Please excuse any typos**

ValHaller

Ju78 wrote: »

Hi people,

Please can someone give me some advice.

Yes, start a new thread, please. It really will not help tough_si to have your problem mixed up with his if he needs to come back. And it won't help you either.

And only post once on a problem.

Ju78

ValHaller wrote: »

Yes, start a new thread, please. It really will not help tough_si to have your problem mixed up with his if he needs to come back. And it won't help you either.

And only post once on a problem.

Apologies, this is my first time posting. Once I work out how to start a new thread I will take this one down if possible.