Disciplinary action: what are my options?

Totee

Here's the story, I'll try to explain as much as I can. And as honestly as I can.

I'm a manager of a bar/club. Have worked at the place for just over 2 years. The bar is independently owned. The owner (or the person who's seen by everyone as the owner, despite the fact his official title is "consultant" as he's banned from being a director, but the company is in someone else's name. Together they act as co-directors and I have to answer to them both) is bringing disciplinary procedures against me citing "a number of things that have recently came to my attention".

This was on Tuesday of last week. I was told I would have a disciplinary meeting on the Thursday, it was cancelled at 4 hours notice and rescheduled for Monday (yesterday). I worked as normal on the Thursday night. On the Friday morning I was emailed telling me I was suspended until Monday for making "an unauthorized payment". The payment was 100% authorized. It was a payment to a sub contractor that was authorized on the Friday if the week before, but he came to collect it a few days late. There was no issue with what was owed to him. It was an authorized payment.

So on Monday, the day of my disciplinary meeting, I am texted an hour and a half before it was due to start to say that it has been changed to a "investigational meeting".

I turn up to said meeting on time and it lasts approximately 3 minutes where I am told I have a verbal warning for an issue with a member of staff not doing their job properly and me not checking it. I am then given a written warning for a poor stock take. The meeting ends there. I was not given a chance to speak for myself or defend myself.

The disciplinary meeting is set for Thursday at 1pm. I know for a fact that he will have cooked up another reason to give me another written warning and thus dismiss me. And that today was him essentially setting me up for dismissal by giving me a verbal then a written warning.

My record before this was clean by the way.

My question is this basically, what are my options?

Do I attend the disciplinary meeting, get dismissed and accept it?

Do I resign

Do I resign stating "constructive dismissal" ?

And most importantly, do I have a case for an employment tribunal.

I should add, my contract states "duty manager" and on my list of responsibilities, stock take results are not one of them. The previous general manager was dismissed.

The place has had 6 managers in two years. He's a tyrant who has been taken to (that I know of) 3 tribunals and lost. And he's trying to get rid of me doing it by the book, but I feel he's messed up somewhere and I have a case.

Sorry if this was overly long, just trying to give you most of the story.

monty-doggy

Hello

First of all please ignore what you know about previous managers. It's not in the owners interest to keep on replacing managers, it's costs time and money to recruit and induct them. You need to detach yourself from this.

If you were handed a warning at an investigation meeting then they have not followed procedure. An investigation should be just that, with an invite to disciplinary to then provide sanction.

You should be given notice in writing of these meetings.

Constructive dismissal is almost impossible to prove, however as you have more than two years service you may be able to claim unfair dismissal, but you would only be claiming for loss of earnings rather than compensation for hurt feelings etc.

Have you got a proper contract and a copy of the disciplinary process?

Have you called ACAS for advice?

If the owner is really that bad, I'd be finding a new job regardless.

Missme

Totee wrote: »

Here's the story, I'll try to explain as much as I can. And as honestly as I can.

I'm a manager of a bar/club. Have worked at the place for just over 2 years. The bar is independently owned. The owner (or the person who's seen by everyone as the owner, despite the fact his official title is "consultant" as he's banned from being a director, but the company is in someone else's name. Together they act as co-directors and I have to answer to them both) is bringing disciplinary procedures against me citing "a number of things that have recently came to my attention".

This was on Tuesday of last week. I was told I would have a disciplinary meeting on the Thursday, it was cancelled at 4 hours notice and rescheduled for Monday (yesterday). I worked as normal on the Thursday night. On the Friday morning I was emailed telling me I was suspended until Monday for making "an unauthorized payment". The payment was 100% authorized. It was a payment to a sub contractor that was authorized on the Friday if the week before, but he came to collect it a few days late. There was no issue with what was owed to him. It was an authorized payment.

So on Monday, the day of my disciplinary meeting, I am texted an hour and a half before it was due to start to say that it has been changed to a "investigational meeting".

I turn up to said meeting on time and it lasts approximately 3 minutes where I am told I have a verbal warning for an issue with a member of staff not doing their job properly and me not checking it. I am then given a written warning for a poor stock take. The meeting ends there. I was not given a chance to speak for myself or defend myself.

The disciplinary meeting is set for Thursday at 1pm. I know for a fact that he will have cooked up another reason to give me another written warning and thus dismiss me. And that today was him essentially setting me up for dismissal by giving me a verbal then a written warning.

My record before this was clean by the way.

My question is this basically, what are my options?

Do I attend the disciplinary meeting, get dismissed and accept it?

Do I resign

Do I resign stating "constructive dismissal" ?

And most importantly, do I have a case for an employment tribunal.

I should add, my contract states "duty manager" and on my list of responsibilities, stock take results are not one of them. The previous general manager was dismissed.

The place has had 6 managers in two years. He's a tyrant who has been taken to (that I know of) 3 tribunals and lost. And he's trying to get rid of me doing it by the book, but I feel he's messed up somewhere and I have a case.

Sorry if this was overly long, just trying to give you most of the story.

Think I know that book. It's called "How to Make a Dog's Breakfast" by F Itup.

Mr Bossman has obviously read Chapter 7 (which you'll find on page 3 after the preface), " [STRIKE]Righting[/STRIKE] [STRIKE]Wrighting[/STRIKE] Writing the Policy Wrongly as You Go Along".

When someone seems to want rid of you so badly that they fall over themselves in their excitement, it's time to look for another job.

Totee

I've been looking for a job for about 6 weeks but a combination of lack of time and to an extent, comfortableness with getting regulary paid means I never put as much time into it as I probably should have.

If I resign am I entitled to acquired holiday pay? If I'm sacked am I entitled to it?

I've accepted the fact that I need a new job, to be honest it's a relief knowing it's coming to an end. I just want to know if I have a case for a tribunal. I know that tribunals are notoriously hard to win. So is it worth my effort.

I've got a copy of my contract, but there's nothing about a disciplinary process in it.

Is getting a verbal, written then final written warnings in a matter of days unheard of? For 3, relatively conspicuous things? One of which isn't my responsibility according to my contract?

I should be more clued up on employment laws but I'm not so any help is appreciated.

ohreally

Totee wrote: »

Is getting a verbal, written then final written warnings in a matter of days unheard of? For 3, relatively conspicuous things? One of which isn't my responsibility according to my contract

These are not warnings in a disciplinary sense.

The allegations should be put to you in writing, managements evidence should be provided then a hearing convened to allow you to test their evidence and to put your case.

What has happened doesn't constitute disciplinary outcomes in any way, shape or form.

dancingfairy

As someonelse has said, constructive dismissal is very, very hard to prove. A figure oft bandied about on here is that only about 2% of cases are successful. I don't think you can rely on anything that any other managers have managed to prove though. Also taking someone to tribunal can cost upwards of 1000 pounds so is not a route to be taken lightly. Frankly a warning for 3 relatively minor offences, I can't see how that can be a case for constructive dismissal to be honest. It sounds a bit flimsy to me.
If you resign you may well not get benefits.
I think you need to stay and fight this rubbish and also get looking for a new job in the meantime.
You need to get hold of the disciplinary policy and also take to ACAS or someone who can advise on how to appeal this/ what proper steps you should take.
df

Missme

If you resign or get sacked, your employer will need to work out whether you have any untaken accrued leave and pay you for it.

A disciplinary process is unlikely to be written into the contract itself. Do you have a seperate handbook (I'm laughing as I write) with policies in it?

If there is no formal policy or procedure then it's difficult to argue unfair dismissal on the basis of not having followed a procedure. But the cack-handed disciplinary-whoops no-investigation you describe might imply that there is a procedure and handing out sanctions at an 'invesigatorial' meeting (which is supposed to determine if there has been a disciplinary offence before a hearing) would seem to have breached it.

Totee

Thanks for the help so far guys.

I realise that going down the employment tribunal
Route would be a particularly stressful and costly road, but I just don't want him to get away with what he's doing. He's the most old school person and I know he's tripped up somewhere trying to so it "by the book". It's just a case of if that's enough to go anywhere with it.

Ideally all I want is the wages and holiday pay I'm due. But part of me wants to take it further.

Totee

Quick question, if I'm dismissed, am I entitled to the holiday hours I've acquired?

mariefab

Yes.


Some things that you may want to consider...


1. Unless you already have a written agreement/contract stating that any period of suspension will be unpaid; you are entitled to be paid for your normal hours from Friday morning until your dismissal (if that happens) or until your suspension ends.

2. Verbal and or written warnings can't be issued at "investigational" meetings. Investigation meetings are to establish whether or not a disciplinary meeting is required.
So, whatever was issued to you on Monday is null and void.
You should tell your employer this at the start of the meeting.
As long as you have no previous disciplinary issues with this employer, be aware that you are attending the meeting today with a 100% clean disciplinary record.

3. Before today's meeting you should have been informed of what the disciplinary charges are and, if appropriate, what evidence the employer has to support those charges so that you can properly defend yourself.

4. It's a bit late now but you are legally entitled to have a union rep. or a work colleague accompany you at a disciplinary meeting.
In your place I'd phone the employer asap pointing this out and try to arrange for a colleague to attend with you because I'd want to have a witness to a least take notes during this farce.

You might want to jot some of this down, make 2 copies, and hand one in at the start of the meeting.

Totee

Just a small update.

Had the "disciplinary meeting" today and threw the wee curve ball at him at the very beginning that he couldn't give verbal or written warnings at a investigational meeting. And that the meeting we were having would be to discuss the two matter he brought up on Monday.

He had no idea, he said the disciplinary meeting today was to discuss another matter. When I told him he'd need to go through the proper processes to discuss another disciplinary matter his face was a picture.

It's a small victory, and it's not made any difference other than the next meeting is scheduled for Monday and I've basically just win another weeks wages since I'm still suspended.

But the guy is used to sacking people on the spot so he's got no clue about trying to get rid of people legally. And if anyone has any other help ill trip him up again on Monday.

For me the position is now untenable, I won't be back and I'll accept the outcome when it comes I it. It's all about getting what I'm due to be honest and any small victory helps that.