UKPC PCN advice appreciated

suki1

I would greatly appreciate any advice on a pcn received from UKPC. recently. I did pay the required amount for 2 hours parking and displayed properly and returned well within the time limit. However, I completely failed to notice that I had parked in a residents only bay. So have received a PCN of £90 for parking in a residents bay without displaying a permit. If the charge were in line with a council fine I would have no quibbles paying as I shouldn't have parked in the residents bay, however this charge is extortionate. I am aware that procedure would be to appeal to UKPC who will usually reject and then go on to POPLA however I am worried as there is not much I can do to defend the fact that I parked in a marked residents bay when it comes to POPLA. Or is this fact irrelevant and I should just concentrate on the points that there was no loss to the company and no contract was agreed upon? Many thanks for any advice

Guys_Dad

This is an amalgamation of previous advice I have given.

You are making the newbies' common mistake which is "I done wrong, guv, so they are right to charge me. How can I defend that??".

Our point is " regardless of the facts, PPCs are penalising motorists to a ludicrous extent to which they are not entitled and we concentrate on helping people based on that point"

Suppose you had been caught doing 35 mph in a 30 mph limit. You get to the Magistrates court and they say "Guilty. Lock him up for 2 years".

You would get a brief to appeal the sentence, not the verdict.

So that's the case here. You are appealing the "sentence" of £100 that does not fit the "crime",

So, you major on the "No genuine pre-estimate of loss" point.

Also, suppose the PPC didn't have the right to charge you 1p as they didn't have a valid contract with the landowner? So you demand that they produce the contract in question that actually specifies that they are allowed to charge you.

Going back to the "crime" of speeding. Suppose that there were no 30mph signs up and it wasn't obvious that you were in built up area. Would that be fair? So you challenge the signage of the park in question. Obviously the signage was inadequate or you would have seen it.

Basically, that's it in a nutshell.

So, was your PCN a windscreen ticket? If not, have you had the Notice to Keeper and if so, date of contravention and date of NtK please.

suki1

Lol, yes I definitely have that guilty "done wrong guv" feeling. Thanks Guys Dad for painting a clear picture of the issue for us newbies. Will wait for the notice to keeper and then concentrate on the fact that the charge is not a genuine estimate of loss and that there is no valid contract with the landowner. The pcn was on the windscreen and just got it on the weekend. So will be a while I guess till the Notice to Keeper comes in the post. Many thanks for your advice

Coupon-mad

The NTK can't be sent until next month so read a few threads in the meantime to see how to appeal and how we all win at POPLA.

suki1

The NTK eventually arrived and the appeal was sent off to UKPC on the basis of inadequate signage and no genuine pre-estimate of loss and demanding a POPLA code. Now received their response stating that I did not have a residents parking permit displayed blah, blah, and that all UKPC signage is within BPA guidelines, however they will very kindly reduce the charge to £50. No POPLA code. Am at a loss of what I now need to write to them, so that they will give me a POPLA code. Will a straight forward, "I will not enter into any future correspondance and demand a POPLA code in order to take this further " suffice?
Many thanks for any advice.

Hot_Bring

Tell them that they HAVE to provide a POPLA code and that you will be reporting them to the BPA and DVLA requesting sanctions. Then look at the Newbies thread and actually report them to the BPA and DVLA.

Coupon-mad

suki1 wrote: »

The NTK eventually arrived and the appeal was sent off to UKPC on the basis of inadequate signage and no genuine pre-estimate of loss and demanding a POPLA code. Now received their response stating that I did not have a residents parking permit displayed blah, blah, and that all UKPC signage is within BPA guidelines, however they will very kindly reduce the charge to £50. No POPLA code. Am at a loss of what I now need to write to them, so that they will give me a POPLA code. Will a straight forward, "I will not enter into any future correspondance and demand a POPLA code in order to take this further " suffice?
Many thanks for any advice.

Well they have to send the keeper a code...as long as you did appeal as keeper? Not implying who was driving of course, or the whole point of waiting was lost.

If the driver has not been identified (hope not) you just send the usual complaint email to the BPA that you will see on lots of threads, sent to Steve Clark. You'll find the wording & his email address when you search this forum for 'Steve Clark' I reckon (and change the default search to 'show posts' to break it straight down to a particular post for each result you get. People often have to complain to him about no POPLA code.

You can also write back to UKPC and point out that keepers can appeal to POPLA, as per 22.14 of the BPA CoP and they must supply your code (and that you've already complained to Mr Clark at the BPA because as keeper you appealed as soon as you got the letter about it).

Same question just asked here about another PPC. This happens all the time as the PPCs don't like to admit that a keeper can appeal:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4860841

and here:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/64284047#Comment_64284047

Not sure exactly what the numbskull PPCs think a 'Notice to Keeper' is for then, if not to mimic an NTO and afford the keeper their chance to appeal!