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Debate House Prices
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BOE: "Not our job to regulate house prices"
Comments
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Graham_Devon wrote: »While your sums are somewhat out I'd imagne, it's not all about the profit or how much it costs. However, on that note, you don't appear to have allowed for the asset wealth created. You've just looked at the cost of building and not looked at the asset wealth created.
But....
£1bn would also house 5,000 families in secure, healthy homes. Homes allowing people to start putting roots down in their local community.
It's not all about the money or the best investment. Though I realise on this we will likely forever disagree, so just putting my two cents in really rather than trying to change any mindsets.
I agree 100% about the need for more housing. We agree so no need to change my mindset.
Not quite sure your point about 'secure, healthy homes' or about putting roots down in their local community as one would assume that all new housing meets that criteria.0 -
You can change the numbers to those appropriate in your area and come up with a different (better?) set of figures.
But is does show that whilst HB costs are high, we are not going to make a quick cash flow win, by state building lots of council housing.
Did you go to the George Osborne school of arithmetic?
Unless my calculator has got a zero missing even on your figures I think you are out by a factor of 10.
With a build cost of 100k - we always have CPO.£ 20bn, annual budget for HB could see 200 000 built per year, repaid in 9 years on the same basis.
Appreciate there are other overheads but even 20 years wouldn't be that bad."If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
grizzly1911 wrote: »Did you go to the George Osborne school of arithmetic?
Unless my calculator has got a zero missing even on your figures I think you are out by a factor of 10.
With a build cost of 100k - we always have CPO.£ 20bn, annual budget for HB could see 200 000 built per year, repaid in 9 years on the same basis.
Appreciate there are other overheads but even 20 years wouldn't be that bad.
I don't think the true cost of building a variety of properties over the country is 100k unless, of course you are excluding land costs and building only one bed flats in places where there is no shortage.
My point is that even though HB is expensive, there is a considerable timescale to break even.0 -
grizzly1911 wrote: »Did you go to the George Osborne school of arithmetic?
Unless my calculator has got a zero missing even on your figures I think you are out by a factor of 10.
With a build cost of 100k - we always have CPO.£ 20bn, annual budget for HB could see 200 000 built per year, repaid in 9 years on the same basis.
Appreciate there are other overheads but even 20 years wouldn't be that bad.
Think you are right £60m a year HB so 16.6 years not bad.
Or another way borrow £1billion at 3% £30m a year interest HB £60m saving £30m0 -
I don't think the true cost of building a variety of properties over the country is 100k unless, of course you are excluding land costs and building only one bed flats in places where there is no shortage.
My point is that even though HB is expensive, there is a considerable timescale to break even.
£1K/Sqm - in bulk? + CPO and a contribution of £50K a property?
I wouldn't consider somewhere between 10 - 20 years along payback for a solid asset possibly less if the increased HB cost for not doing it is taken into account.
It takes a considerable time for Joe Punter to buy a mediocre house that is life.
We are quite happy to saddle university students with 25/30 year debts, would be homeowners with 30/40 year debts.
Ask for a project without payback in less than 5years and can't possibly do that. A key failing in modern day UK plc.
Never mind I take it.an escalating HB bill can easily be serviced. I wonder how much of that leaves the country through landlords pockets?"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
grizzly1911 wrote: »£1K/Sqm - in bulk? + CPO and a contribution of £50K a property?
I wouldn't consider somewhere between 10 - 20 years along payback for a solid asset possibly less if the increased HB cost for not doing it is taken into account.
It takes a considerable time for Joe Punter to buy a mediocre house that is life.
We are quite happy to saddle university students with 25/30 year debts, would be homeowners with 30/40 year debts.
Ask for a project without payback in less than 5years and can't possibly do that. A key failing in modern day UK plc.
Never mind I take it.an escalating HB bill can easily be serviced. I wonder how much of that leaves the country through landlords pockets?
I've no idea what your post means.
However, it seems unlikely that a mix of 1,2,3,4 bed properties built throughout areas of housing shortage ( which includes London and the south east ) will cost less than 200,000 per property (including land and other costs).
Whether the state undertaking such an exercise is the best use of taxpayers money is a worthwhile discussion.0 -
I've no idea what your post means.
However, it seems unlikely that a mix of 1,2,3,4 bed properties built throughout areas of housing shortage ( which includes London and the south east ) will cost less than 200,000 per property (including land and other costs).
Whether the state undertaking such an exercise is the best use of taxpayers money is a worthwhile discussion.grizzly1911 wrote: »£1K/Sqm - in bulk? + CPO and a contribution of £50K a property?
50sqm property @ £1k per sqm = £50k leaving £50k per plot contribution. 50sqm doesn't seem small. Perhaps someone with real knowledge can tell me whether £1k/sqm (in round terms) is unrealistic for volume build. If land cost is an issue and we need housing that cannot be provided through free market means there is always "CPO".
I wouldn't consider somewhere between 10 - 20 years along payback for a solid asset possibly less if the increased HB cost for not doing it is taken into account.
Is 10 -20 years along pay back period after which you have an a debt free asset? If yes why do people take on mortgages? In the interim HB will continue to rise as demand remains unfulfilled and inflation bites.
It takes a considerable time for Joe Punter to buy a mediocre house that is life.
We are quite happy to saddle university students with 25/30 year debts, would be homeowners with 30/40 year debts.
It seems it is OK for private individuals to take on long term debt without a guaranteed repayment vehicle, the government even encourages it but seems that government doesn't have the faith in itself.
Ask for a project without payback in less than 5years and can't possibly do that. A key failing in modern day UK plc. Long term investment in this country appears limited without government underwriting.
Never mind I take it.an escalating HB bill can easily be serviced. I wonder how much of that leaves the country through landlords pockets?
Servicing an Increasing HB bill is well within the capability of government finances?
Does that help?"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
50 sqm could be
lounge 4 x 4 = 16
kitchen /diner say 4 x 3 = 12
bedroom 4 x 3 = 12
bathroom 2 x 3 = 6
hall way etc say 6
total = 52 square meter for one bed flat?
is that unreasonable?
one would expect 2, 3, 4 bed places to be larger0 -
50 sqm could be
lounge 4 x 4 = 16
kitchen /diner say 4 x 3 = 12
bedroom 4 x 3 = 12
bathroom 2 x 3 = 6
hall way etc say 6
total = 52 square meter for one bed flat?
is that unreasonable?
one would expect 2, 3, 4 bed places to be larger
Generous by modern standards.
Just looked at a couple of 2bed semis and theyw ere running around 52sqm, increase it to 70sqm it doesn't throw the overall figures out that much certainly not by a factor of 10.
Building some 1/2 beds might even help the bedroom tax work freeing up those 3/4 beds. But that wasn't really the purpose of that idea.
We can still keep paying the increasing HB and hope that hope for divine intervention."If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
grizzly1911 wrote: »Generous by modern standards.
Just looked at a couple of 2bed semis and theyw ere running around 52sqm, increase it to 70sqm it doesn't throw the overall figures out that much certainly not by a factor of 10.
Building some 1/2 beds might even help the bedroom tax work freeing up those 3/4 beds. But that wasn't really the purpose of that idea.
We can still keep paying the increasing HB and hope that hope for divine intervention.
100,000 is not a realistic price for an average property taking into account all the cost including land etc in areas where we have housing need.0
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