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APCOA Luton Airport Parking DONT PAY
Tallone_2
Posts: 5 Forumite
After receiving a PCN from APCOA regarding a contravention at Luton airport for not using the £1 drop off zone I wrote back with the following after receiving help from others on this site.
Apcoa Parking
PO Box 1010
Middlesex
UB8 9NT
Dear Sir or Madam,
Ticket number: LM100
Vehicle registration number:
The unlawful issue of a ‘Notice to Keeper’ (BPA AOS Code of Practice B.22)
I am the registered keeper of a Land Rover motor vehicle registration number
I refer to recent PCN dated 27/8/2013.
I assume your “Parking Charge Notice” and the first line being “Notice is hereby served to the registered keeper” that this is a “Notice to Keeper” and along with other references drawn from the Protection of Freedoms Act (PoFA) it is clear that APCOA is dealing with its claim in accordance with the requirements of Schedule 4 of POFA.
The requirements of Schedule 4 PoFA are quite clear in that there must be strict compliance with all of its requirements in order to take advantage of the rights granted under that Act to pursue the registered keeper in respect of a driver’s alleged debt.
The BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice (version 2) supports the need for strict compliance (para 21.5 refers).
APCOA has however failed to comply with the statutory requirements as follows;
Firstly, in regards to paragraph 9(2)(h) of Schedule 4, PoFA 2012. Whilst your ‘Notice to Keeper’ has indicated that you require a payment to be made to APCOA, there is no specific identification of the “Creditor”, who may, in law, be APCOA or London Luton Airport or, some other party.
PoFA requires a ‘Notice to Keeper’ to have words to the effect that “The Creditor is….”
The wording of Paragraph 9(2)(h) of Schedule 4 of PoFA does not indicate that the “creditor must be named, but “identified”. To “identify” a “Creditor” a parking company must do more than name that person. The driver is entitled to know the identity of the party with whom he has legally contracted.
This view is supported by the Secretary of State for Transport. He has reserved to himself powers to make regulations to specify not only what must be said in a ‘Notice to Keeper’ but also what evidence should be provided.
He says “The purpose of this power is to leave flexibility to mandate the specific evidence which must accompany a notice to keeper if it becomes clear that creditors are attempting to recover parking charges without providing keepers with sufficient evidence to know whether the claim is valid”
Secondly, in addition to APCOA’s failure to specifically identify the “Creditor”, it has failed to provide any evidence that it, or a third party, is entitled to enforce an alleged breach of contractual terms and conditions.
Thirdly, the most serious failure and that which has given me cause to submit a formal complaint to the DVLA.
You have failed to comply with paragraph 9.4 of Schedule 4 of the Act in that you failed to give the Notice to Keeper to me within the “relevant period”.
The alleged infringement occurred on the 10th August 2013 and no ‘Notice to Driver’ was issued at the time. The Notice to Keeper is dated 27th August 2013 which is 17 days after the event and too late to ensure delivery within the statutory 14 days prescribed by PoFA.
Paragraph 9(4) indicates that the Notice to Keeper must be given to the registered keeper not more than 14 days after the car allegedly infringed the car park terms and conditions. Paragraph 9(6) states that “A notice sent by post is to be presumed, unless the contrary is proved, to have been delivered (and so “given” for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4)) on the second working day after the day on which it is posted” which in this case would be the 29th August 2013.
Your company would have been well aware of these facts when it took the decision to send out the Notice to Keeper under PoFA. You have misrepresented the legal position in the full knowledge that there can be no keeper liability.
That is an aggravating feature which the DVLA must take into account in determining what sanction to issue to your company.
I therefore expect you to immediately cancel the ‘parking charge’ and inform me, in writing that you have done so.
If however, you reject this challenge, then, in accordance with the BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice (version 2) 22.12, please ensure that you enclose all the required information (including the necessary ‘POPLA code’) so that I may immediately refer this matter (and any further issues that I may subsequently raise) for their adjudication on the matter.
I do not expect to receive a ‘generic’ template response and which fails to address the specific issues that I have raised with you. No further correspondence will be entered into.
Yours sincerely
[FONT="]A[/FONT]
Apcoa have now written back with
Dear Fred Bloggs
Thankyou for your letter regarding the issue of the above Parking Charge Notice. We have considered fully your explanation of the circumstances and, on this occasion, cancelled the notice. Therefore no further action is required as the case is now considered closed.
Please be advised that there is 30minutes free parking in the mid term car park also, which is ideal for dropping off and picking up passengers. In future do bear in mind that you can make use of the free parking in the Mid Term Car Park also, and it is far more affordable.
If you have received a very official looking letter from APCOA titled PARKING CHARGE NOTICE then research this site and others. Write back. DON'T throw it in the bin. AND DO NOT PAY!!!!!! 10 mins work and the cost of a recorded delivery letter and you save £80.
14th Sept 2013
PO Box 1010
Middlesex
UB8 9NT
Dear Sir or Madam,
Ticket number: LM100
Vehicle registration number:
The unlawful issue of a ‘Notice to Keeper’ (BPA AOS Code of Practice B.22)
I am the registered keeper of a Land Rover motor vehicle registration number
I refer to recent PCN dated 27/8/2013.
I assume your “Parking Charge Notice” and the first line being “Notice is hereby served to the registered keeper” that this is a “Notice to Keeper” and along with other references drawn from the Protection of Freedoms Act (PoFA) it is clear that APCOA is dealing with its claim in accordance with the requirements of Schedule 4 of POFA.
The requirements of Schedule 4 PoFA are quite clear in that there must be strict compliance with all of its requirements in order to take advantage of the rights granted under that Act to pursue the registered keeper in respect of a driver’s alleged debt.
The BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice (version 2) supports the need for strict compliance (para 21.5 refers).
APCOA has however failed to comply with the statutory requirements as follows;
Firstly, in regards to paragraph 9(2)(h) of Schedule 4, PoFA 2012. Whilst your ‘Notice to Keeper’ has indicated that you require a payment to be made to APCOA, there is no specific identification of the “Creditor”, who may, in law, be APCOA or London Luton Airport or, some other party.
PoFA requires a ‘Notice to Keeper’ to have words to the effect that “The Creditor is….”
The wording of Paragraph 9(2)(h) of Schedule 4 of PoFA does not indicate that the “creditor must be named, but “identified”. To “identify” a “Creditor” a parking company must do more than name that person. The driver is entitled to know the identity of the party with whom he has legally contracted.
This view is supported by the Secretary of State for Transport. He has reserved to himself powers to make regulations to specify not only what must be said in a ‘Notice to Keeper’ but also what evidence should be provided.
He says “The purpose of this power is to leave flexibility to mandate the specific evidence which must accompany a notice to keeper if it becomes clear that creditors are attempting to recover parking charges without providing keepers with sufficient evidence to know whether the claim is valid”
Secondly, in addition to APCOA’s failure to specifically identify the “Creditor”, it has failed to provide any evidence that it, or a third party, is entitled to enforce an alleged breach of contractual terms and conditions.
Thirdly, the most serious failure and that which has given me cause to submit a formal complaint to the DVLA.
You have failed to comply with paragraph 9.4 of Schedule 4 of the Act in that you failed to give the Notice to Keeper to me within the “relevant period”.
The alleged infringement occurred on the 10th August 2013 and no ‘Notice to Driver’ was issued at the time. The Notice to Keeper is dated 27th August 2013 which is 17 days after the event and too late to ensure delivery within the statutory 14 days prescribed by PoFA.
Paragraph 9(4) indicates that the Notice to Keeper must be given to the registered keeper not more than 14 days after the car allegedly infringed the car park terms and conditions. Paragraph 9(6) states that “A notice sent by post is to be presumed, unless the contrary is proved, to have been delivered (and so “given” for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4)) on the second working day after the day on which it is posted” which in this case would be the 29th August 2013.
Your company would have been well aware of these facts when it took the decision to send out the Notice to Keeper under PoFA. You have misrepresented the legal position in the full knowledge that there can be no keeper liability.
That is an aggravating feature which the DVLA must take into account in determining what sanction to issue to your company.
I therefore expect you to immediately cancel the ‘parking charge’ and inform me, in writing that you have done so.
If however, you reject this challenge, then, in accordance with the BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice (version 2) 22.12, please ensure that you enclose all the required information (including the necessary ‘POPLA code’) so that I may immediately refer this matter (and any further issues that I may subsequently raise) for their adjudication on the matter.
I do not expect to receive a ‘generic’ template response and which fails to address the specific issues that I have raised with you. No further correspondence will be entered into.
Yours sincerely
[FONT="]A[/FONT]
Apcoa have now written back with
Dear Fred Bloggs
Thankyou for your letter regarding the issue of the above Parking Charge Notice. We have considered fully your explanation of the circumstances and, on this occasion, cancelled the notice. Therefore no further action is required as the case is now considered closed.
Please be advised that there is 30minutes free parking in the mid term car park also, which is ideal for dropping off and picking up passengers. In future do bear in mind that you can make use of the free parking in the Mid Term Car Park also, and it is far more affordable.
If you have received a very official looking letter from APCOA titled PARKING CHARGE NOTICE then research this site and others. Write back. DON'T throw it in the bin. AND DO NOT PAY!!!!!! 10 mins work and the cost of a recorded delivery letter and you save £80.
0
Comments
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Thanks for posting this is a separate thread! People may like to save it to their 'favourites' as a classic example of how to see off APCOA, who have been seen to fold several times when faced with a strong appeal like that. Like here:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/62859837#Comment_62859837
Well done!PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
I have just used the above letter with the necessary amendments to appeal to POPLA and I have won the appeal!
This is the response from POPLA
16 June 2014
Reference xxxxxxxxxxx
always quote in any communication with POPLA
Dear Sir or Madam
xxxxxxxxxxx(Appellant)
-v-
APCOA Parking (UK) Ltd (Operator)
The Operator has informed us that they have cancelled parking charge notice number LMxxxxxxxxxx, issued in respect of a vehicle with the registration mark xxxxxxxxxxx .
Your appeal has therefore been allowed by order of the Lead Adjudicator.
You are not liable for the parking charge and, where appropriate, any amounts already paid in respect of this parking charge notice will be refunded by the Operator.
Yours sincerely,
xxxxxxxxxxxx0 -
The 30 minutes free parking at the mid-term car park is a joke and tantamount to entrapment. It can take 10-15 minutes to get from the mid-term car park to the terminal on the shuttle bus, and the same to get back again, which obviously leaves you no time for whatever business you have at the terminal.Je suis Charlie.0
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The 30 minutes free parking at the mid-term car park is a joke and tantamount to entrapment. It can take 10-15 minutes to get from the mid-term car park to the terminal on the shuttle bus, and the same to get back again, which obviously leaves you no time for whatever business you have at the terminal.
I disagree. I have dropped and collected relatives from LAP several times, and have found that the system works well.
I am not sure what this "business" is to which you refer. Is it arriving in or departing from the UK? If so I would say that in most cases the extra time is not a problem.You never know how far you can go until you go too far.0 -
Yeah well, you could get into a fight on your own in a locked room.
I use Luton Airport several times every year, I always use the mid-term car park unless they are having one of their occasional specials where the short-term car park is cheaper, and I know exactly how long it takes to get to-and-fro. If the bus turns up just as you arrive at the stop you'll be fine, but if you see the bus disappearing up the road you've got a problem if you expect to be there and back in under 30 minutes, especially if the same thing happens the other direction.
From the airport's own website:
Passengers should take the free shuttle bus to the terminal which departs every 10 minutes from a sheltered stop and takes two minutes**
**At peak times the transfer may take longer
So by their own admission you need to allow a minimum of 12 minutes each direction, and from the 6 minutes remaining you need to:
- park your car
- get from your car to the bus stop
- get from the bus to the terminal
- do whatever you have to do in the terminal (crossing your fingers that your target is ready, waiting and easily spotted if you are picking up)
- get from the terminal back to the bus
- get from the bus stop back to your car
- get into your car and leave the car park.
My advice to anyone picking up or dropping off at Luton is:
- Don't use the official pick-up/drop-off area, because they will illegally tow your vehicle at the slightest opportunity
- Don't use the mid-term-car park because of the entrapment described above
- If dropping off, do so on the road right in front of the APCOA camera car
- If picking up, wait in the car park at Gypsy Lane until your target calls to tell you they are ready and waiting, and then drive the mile or so to the airport and pick up on the road right in front of the APCOA camera car
- When the APCOA fake fine arrives, appeal it and win, or ignore it.Je suis Charlie.0 -
In my view Luton Airport is the pits avoid if at all possible!0
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I agree, it's an awful place, but since I only live 10 miles away the hassle and expense of going to another airport just ain't worth it if I can get to my destination from Luton. I have won projects in both Glasgow and Dublin simply 'cos I can get there so easily.Je suis Charlie.0
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Your maths is wrong. If buses depart every 10 minutes & the journey time is two minutes then the maximum is 12 minutes even if you arrive just as a bus is departing & you have to wait the maximum 10 minutes. The average time that you will need to wait is in fact 5 minutes which coupled with the journey time gives 7 minutes each way for a total of 14 minutes. TBH that is still cutting it fine what with getting on & off the bus being held up by people with luggage etcPassengers should take the free shuttle bus to the terminal which departs every 10 minutes from a sheltered stop and takes two minutes**
So by their own admission you need to allow a minimum of 12 minutes each direction, and from the 6 minutes remaining you need to:0 -
Hang on Baster, I do not understand. Why should someone wish to go to and from the terminal. When dropping someone off I leave them at the car park bus stop, and when collecting someone I wait by the bus stop, collect them, and drive off.
On the six or seven times I have used this facility it has worked erfectly. The free parking facility is not intended for people wishing to accompany someone to the terminal or to meet them at the gate.
You really should stop raising these red herrings.You never know how far you can go until you go too far.0
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