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Trying to freeze utility prices - can a labour supporter please explain how?
Comments
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Genuine question, how could utility prices be frozen, will the companies receive a tax subsidy when international gas prices exceed what the gas can be sold for or will the companies be forced in some way to sell at a loss? What happens when they go bankrupt?
There are labour supporters on this board, please explain it.
They could always Nationalise the utility companies ..
Not that I think that was what he was inferring.0 -
let me throw this one on it's head ...
how could you stop interest rates from going up and up and up ...
the state could subsidise financial institutions and if they had no money to do that they could print money and pay with that.
Maybe you could use the same approach to stop the rise in utilities ?0 -
anyone know why prices or gas/electricity are expected to rise between 2015 and dec 2016?
is that green taxes/carbon whatsits, inflation or what?0 -
I too doubt anyone would go bankrupt (apart from those tiny, wannabe suppliers), but wouldn't the issue be more that there would reduced incentive to invest, compete for diminishing margins or even to remain in the market? Short term people go "lower fuel prices :j", longer term the infrastructure gets creaky, new facilities don't get built, etc. Bit like the nuclear situation.grizzly1911 wrote: »Doubt if it will lead to any of the big six going under, doubt it will create fuel shortages (that aren't already a possibility due to limited storage or generating capacity).0 -
anyone know why prices or gas/electricity are expected to rise between 2015 and dec 2016?
is that green taxes/carbon whatsits, inflation or what?
Wholesale prices, green levies, feed in tariffs, fuel poverty subsidies, free replacement boilers for those on certain benefits,[STRIKE]investment[/STRIKE], [STRIKE]storage capacity[/STRIKE], increased dividends, increased executive bonuses, inflation, operational costs associated with increased switching and backhanders to comparison sites, debt servicing costs."If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
grizzly1911 wrote: »Wholesale prices, green levies, feed in tariffs, fuel poverty subsidies, free replacement boilers for those on certain benefits,[STRIKE]investment[/STRIKE], [STRIKE]storage capacity[/STRIKE], increased dividends, increased executive bonuses, inflation, operational costs associated with increased switching and backhanders to comparison sites, debt servicing costs.
I bet 'wholesale prices' is the largest part and I can't see how a govt can control these. Of course they might fall during the fixed period (it has happened before' in which case the suppliers might make a huge windfall profit but equally they may rise and although allegedly suppliers are very profitable I bet they still only make a few percent on turnover and would be wiped out by a 10% increase in wholesale prices.
Still price fixing by govt works well, go to Venezuela and ask for some toilet paper...I think....0 -
Short term people go "lower fuel prices :j", longer term the infrastructure gets creaky, new facilities don't get built, etc. Bit like the nuclear situation.
You are right some will go :j. The infrastructure has already become creaky, new facilities and infrastructure haven't been built so we are already there.
20 months is such a long time in the investment lifecycle it may make the energy companies take a fresh look at whether than extract anything more out of a strangled market.;)"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
The govt could just fix prices at which the utilities companies could sell electricity and gas to consumers. The utilities companies could then recover their losses by charging much higher amounts to corporations. The corporate rate could be variable calculated by taking the operating profit of the company multiplied by the current corporation tax rate minus the actual amount of tax paid. A socialist's wet dream.0
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I bet 'wholesale prices' is the largest part and I can't see how a govt can control these. Of course they might fall during the fixed period (it has happened before' in which case the suppliers might make a huge windfall profit but equally they may rise and although allegedly suppliers are very profitable I bet they still only make a few percent on turnover and would be wiped out by a 10% increase in wholesale prices.
Still price fixing by govt works well, go to Venezuela and ask for some toilet paper...
It is always wholesale prices. We never seem to know which wholesale prices.
Have they never demonstrate how a wholesale price relates to the actual market prices on the exchanges.
As you say the volumes they are dealing with a slight variation would make big differences.
It must be difficult forecasting winter demand in advance as there must be so little consumption data available.
Did Venezuela actually fix the price per sheet?
I once camped at a Forestry Commission site and the hard/shiny toilet paper had Property of HM Government stamped on every sheet."If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
the state could subsidise financial institutions and if they had no money to do that they could print money and pay with that.
Maybe you could use the same approach to stop the rise in utilities ?
Don't they already underwrite, guarantee the unit price of energy for new generating initiatives/investments - isn't that essentially the same thing?
Isn't that one of the reasons commitment on new nuclear builds are in limbo because the appropriate rate has yet to be agreed."If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0
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