HS2 Budget: £40bn

CLAPTON

zagubov wrote: »

I was trying to recall (too lazy to look it up) from last century when we were affluent enough to be in/start or join a war almost every single year.

There were even occasions when governments formed war cabinets that excluded finance ministers to stop the rest being distracted from the vital job in hand- it certainnly did happen, but not sure it was Churchill.

most of our wars were financed by borrowing

and we have been in wars pretty regularly since then

but not sure what it has to do with railways but it is sunday

MacMickster

Exile_geordie wrote: »

How? Building £40Bn worth of housing will only benefit the economy until they are built. After that, nothing.

High speed passenger travel will be contributing to it every single year, year after year, long after it has been built. And by taking passengers off the already congested WCML will make more paths for freight trains to run during the day which will take more lorries off the road which is better for the environment too.

Building £40 billion pounds of housing will help to reduce house prices, pressure on wages and housing benefits. If it is social housing then the rents received should produce a small return for the taxpayer too.

ILW

MacMickster wrote: »

Building £40 billion pounds of housing will help to reduce house prices, pressure on wages and housing benefits. If it is social housing then the rents received should produce a small return for the taxpayer too.

Reduced house prices would affect banks balance sheets. Nothing will be done that could reduce prices for that reason.

CLAPTON

MacMickster wrote: »

Building £40 billion pounds of housing will help to reduce house prices, pressure on wages and housing benefits. If it is social housing then the rents received should produce a small return for the taxpayer too.

£40 billion spread over 10 years at, say 150,000 per house, is about 26,000 per annum

a useful addition to the housing supply but unlikely to lead to a price fall

zagubov

CLAPTON wrote: »

Maybe one needs to reflect why millions of people disagree with you and flock to London when they could go to Central Scotland.

Oh dear. You had to go and ruin it by opening that door. In the early 80s we tried to find work wherever it occurred. buy an amazing trick of legerdemain, the jobs in central Scotland disappeared and replacement jobs appeared in London.
So instead of the UK developing a Munich and Frankfurt and Hamburg or Cologne it just developed a Paris. An absolute travesty that needs remedying fast rather than celebrating.:eek:

CLAPTON wrote: »

most of our wars were financed by borrowing

and we have been in wars pretty regularly since then

but not sure what it has to do with railways but it is sunday

Well i think that environmental degradation needs the equivalent of a wart effort against it, and unless you've a better one, rail transport's a possible strategy against it.

CLAPTON

zagubov wrote: »

Oh dear. You had to go and ruin it by opening that door. In the early 80s we tried to find work wherever it occurred. buy an amazing trick of legerdemain, the jobs in central Scotland disappeared and replacement jobs appeared in London.
So instead of the UK developing a Munich and Frankfurt and Hamburg or Cologne it just developed a Paris. An absolute travesty that needs remedying fast rather than celebrating.:eek:

Well i think that environmental degradation needs the equivalent of a wart effort against it, and unless you've a better one, rail transport's a possible strategy against it.

No idea what you are trying to say.

Spending billions of pounds because you sort of have a vague feeling that rail transport seem a possible strategy against whatever, is difficult to get to grips with.

Is there really nothing else worth spending billions on?

[Deleted User]

CLAPTON wrote: »

Maybe one needs to reflect why millions of people disagree with you and flock to London when they could go to Central Scotland.

... ,my point was that the current policies exacerbate the situation where an already overheated, crowded and expensive area of the country becomes even more overheated, crowded and expensive. It may be an exaggeration but I think a comedian pointed out that a glass of tap water in London has probably been through the kidneys of four other people on the way (enjoy your cuppa!).

Rather than encourage more centralisation I'd prefer a bit of spreading the activity and prosperity a bit wider. I suppose I'd be happier for the extra hundreds of thousands of folk to be fighting for jobs, houses and a quality of life in London, rather than an extra hundred thousand doing that in Edinburgh. I'm not so sure a young person wanting a flat in London would agree with you, but it looks like you're getting your way.

I used to commute by train for 7 minutes - plus 2 mins walk to station and the same from station to work. When I worked in Fife, I heard that the Glenrothes Development Corporation had signs in the London Underground saying something like "In Glenrothes, the rush hour lasts 20 minutes".

All I'm pointing out is that I think there are social justice and cohesion advantages in spreading the investment and resulting wealth around.

WR

CLAPTON

Wild_Rover wrote: »

... ,my point was that the current policies exacerbate the situation where an already overheated, crowded and expensive area of the country becomes even more overheated, crowded and expensive. It may be an exaggeration but I think a comedian pointed out that a glass of tap water in London has probably been through the kidneys of four other people on the way (enjoy your cuppa!).

Rather than encourage more centralisation I'd prefer a bit of spreading the activity and prosperity a bit wider. I suppose I'd be happier for the extra hundreds of thousands of folk to be fighting for jobs, houses and a quality of life in London, rather than an extra hundred thousand doing that in Edinburgh. I'm not so sure a young person wanting a flat in London would agree with you, but it looks like you're getting your way.

I used to commute by train for 7 minutes - plus 2 mins walk to station and the same from station to work. When I worked in Fife, I heard that the Glenrothes Development Corporation had signs in the London Underground saying something like "In Glenrothes, the rush hour lasts 20 minutes".

All I'm pointing out is that I think there are social justice and cohesion advantages in spreading the investment and resulting wealth around.

WR

I don't 'have a way'

I am simply stating the facts of real people's choices (I don't live in London although I know it very well).

I, indeed agree, that I would welcome other centres of excellence in the UK but the question is how one does this.

Simply wishing it were true is insufficient and spending 40 billion on a railway between London and Birmingham won't do that.

zagubov

CLAPTON wrote: »

No idea what you are trying to say.

Spending billions of pounds because you sort of have a vague feeling that rail transport seem a possible strategy against whatever, is difficult to get to grips with.

Is there really nothing else worth spending billions on?

Well that's what's really wrong.

Many countries spread their development widely but I don't know if you've noticed that the UK didn't. It ended up with a bloated congested city and many underdeveloped cities . The imbalance needs to be remedied.

If the free market isn't up to the job, so much the worse for it, other avenues may need to be investigated.

I'm from Central Scotland but work and live in London. From what I can see hardly anyone here has the quality of life (schooling/housing etc.) they'd have in Glasgow/Edinburgh.

Brassedoff

I don't hug trees or want to stroke bunnies. That makes me in the improve infrastructure camp. Here's how I would do it.

1. Cast aside the delays in getting the fracking underway. Reports suggest there are £10,800 trillion worth of gas in England.

This would:

1. Clear our national debt.
2. Supply enough natural gas for 160 years if we only use 10% of what's there.
3. Build 10 new nuclear power stations to accommodate the boom the projects would bring.
4. Use the earnings to upgrade all motorways to 8 lanes where possible.
5. Build HS2 & 3 into Scotland, HS4 into South Wales
6. Build the replacement for Heathrow where they said they were going to a few years ago, between Coventry & Rugby
7. Provide free university education to all UK national, thereby up scaling the knowledge base of this nation.
8. Embark on a major heavy engineering/manufacturing plan (7 will help this)
9. Build 4 new aircraft carriers and support vessels to protect our interested.
10. Invest earnings from gas into a sovereign fund that buys back our utilities and purchases other nations gems. (Use 9 to protect it)

Make me King!