How will these factors change CS payments?

Missmouse

The background:

My husband has 3 children with his ex wife who are now: 20, 17 & 15. Ex wife went to csa after a short period of a private arrangement as she thought she would get more money. She ended up getting less which she was furious about.
When the 20 yr old reached 18 and finished A levels, his ex wife carried on claiming child benefit for her, even when she moved out & went to university. This meant csa continued to take payments & told my husband there was nothing they could do about finding out if the CB was fraudulent. The ex only stopped claiming child benefit for the eldest when the eldest had a huge tantrum about it - as my husband had said he once csa stopped, he would give his child the £ direct to support her through uni.


My husband was willing to pay more than the CSA had calculated & didn't want to cheat his 2 children still living with his ex out of £ he could afford, so eventually they shut their CSA account & went back to private arrangement which was a lot more money.



So they started with CSA in 2008 and shut account near end of 2011.


The circumstances:


He has the children for a weekend(2 nights) every other w/end.


We are now expecting ex wife to go back to the CSA as once again she is furious that I am expecting my 2nd child. We didn't tell the CSA about my 1st child who is 2yrs old as he was born during the private arrangement era.


So my husband is self employed. He has 1 client who pays him £1600 a month. Am I right in thinking they will take 20% from £1600 (my 2 kids) then calculate 15% of what's left over for each child living with his ex?


The 17yr old is about to be thrown out of college - would that affect csa? Also the 17 yr old turns 18 in a few months, would husband still pay if the child is not in education? We suspect the 17yr old will claim job seekers when he turns 18 so again, would that affect payments? What if he gets a job? Or an apprenticeship ?


Will we be in the same situation where, even if she is not eligible for child benefit from this 17/18 child, she won't tell the cb office? I'm not sure if child benefit stops if the child decides to drop out or start work etc.


My stepchildren live hours & hours away, husband used to drive for 7 hours to get them. Now they are teens he pays a fortune in train fares to get them back & forth. Would this be factored in?




Husband still supports 20 yr old financially, thou I'm sure the csa won't care about this?




Dont know if this affects things but we do not claim child benefit or anything for our 2 year old or ourselves. Ex wife works part time & claims variety of benefits, not sure what, definitely child benefit and something towards her rent but possibly others.


If they started csa in 2008, would husband be under csa1, 2 or 3? Would re opening in 2013 mean he starts on whatever's the latest thing? Not really sure about what csa1,2,3 means - I gather they each have slightly different rules/ circumstances.





When we try the csa calculator it says £5?! Which is obviously mad.


Sorry for the essay but can't find answers online & don't want to phone csa as found them dofficult last time & nothing's actually happening yet!

clearingout

why would you not claim child benefit for your own children?

clearingout

Missmouse wrote: »

The background:

My husband has 3 children with his ex wife who are now: 20, 17 & 15. Ex wife went to csa after a short period of a private arrangement as she thought she would get more money. She ended up getting less which she was furious about.
When the 20 yr old reached 18 and finished A levels, his ex wife carried on claiming child benefit for her, even when she moved out & went to university. This meant csa continued to take payments & told my husband there was nothing they could do about finding out if the CB was fraudulent. The ex only stopped claiming child benefit for the eldest when the eldest had a huge tantrum about it - as my husband had said he once csa stopped, he would give his child the £ direct to support her through uni.


My husband was willing to pay more than the CSA had calculated & didn't want to cheat his 2 children still living with his ex out of £ he could afford, so eventually they shut their CSA account & went back to private arrangement which was a lot more money.



So they started with CSA in 2008 and shut account near end of 2011.


The circumstances:


He has the children for a weekend(2 nights) every other w/end.


We are now expecting ex wife to go back to the CSA as once again she is furious that I am expecting my 2nd child. We didn't tell the CSA about my 1st child who is 2yrs old as he was born during the private arrangement era.


So my husband is self employed. He has 1 client who pays him £1600 a month. Am I right in thinking they will take 20% from £1600 (my 2 kids) then calculate 15% of what's left over for each child living with his ex? He is liable for maintenance after the appropriate deductions have been made, not before.


The 17yr old is about to be thrown out of college - would that affect csa? Also the 17 yr old turns 18 in a few months, would husband still pay if the child is not in education? We suspect the 17yr old will claim job seekers when he turns 18 so again, would that affect payments? What if he gets a job? Or an apprenticeship ? theoretically, yes, if the 17 year old isn't in college, no CSA should be due. the CSA will have a list of courses that count as education and those that don't - I'm not sure where apprenticeships sit with that.


Will we be in the same situation where, even if she is not eligible for child benefit from this 17/18 child, she won't tell the cb office? I'm not sure if child benefit stops if the child decides to drop out or start work etc.the CSA will charge as long as child benefit is paid. Your only option is to report her for fraud but you won't necessarily get wind of the outcome of that.


My stepchildren live hours & hours away, husband used to drive for 7 hours to get them. Now they are teens he pays a fortune in train fares to get them back & forth. Would this be factored in?
theoretically it's possible to claim for travel costs which relate to maintaining contact. The practise is that once the calculations are done, it never amounts to anywhere near what actual travel costs are. I am also not sure that you'll be able to claim for the children's travel- you'd have to ask.



Husband still supports 20 yr old financially, thou I'm sure the csa won't care about this? yes, that is outwith the CSA's jurisdiction.




Dont know if this affects things but we do not claim child benefit or anything for our 2 year old or ourselves. Ex wife works part time & claims variety of benefits, not sure what, definitely child benefit and something towards her rent but possibly others. as above, why would you not claim child benefit for your own children? the ex wife claiming various benefits has nothing at all to do with her being able to claim child maintenance for qualifying children who live with her.


If they started csa in 2008, would husband be under csa1, 2 or 3? Would re opening in 2013 mean he starts on whatever's the latest thing? Not really sure about what csa1,2,3 means - I gather they each have slightly different rules/ circumstances.CSA2. If the case was closed, it would still be reopened on CSA2 - CSA3 only for cases with 4 or more children involved. Although I assume that means qualifying children not children in total. Can anyone clarify?





When we try the csa calculator it says £5?! Which is obviously mad.it may well be right. Morally, of course, is another issue.


Sorry for the essay but can't find answers online & don't want to phone csa as found them dofficult last time & nothing's actually happening yet!

my response in red (I hope!) above.

Missmouse

thank you so much for the helpful advice. i really appreciate you taking the time. To answer why i haven't claimed : I am self employed as well, and can go through periods of earning large amounts. After I had my baby I enquired about what I would be eligible for and was told by the child benefit helpline I was not entitled as our household earnings were too high. I talked to my accountant who told me I could go and talk to citizens advice but if I was going to be in & out of high paid contracts then it could get messy with informimg them of my earning changes all the time. Because I was worried about benefit fraud I have never chase or pushed this. I think once upon a time you could be a millionaire & still get child support but now there is a cap on earnings or something?

Missmouse

Oh and the reason I mentioned his ex claiming benefits is because the csa calculator asked if the parent with care claimed any of a list of benefits . So I thought this must be a factor but not sure why

HoneyNutLoop

The calculator shouldn't ask for any info about the parent with care, although it does ask if the non-resident parent is receiving any benefits:
"Does the parent paying child maintenance get any of these benefits"
If you answered yes to that, it would come back saying the amount to pay is £5, because that is the amount that NRP's on benefit should pay unless they qualify for the shared care reduction.

Missmouse

Im wondering if I have to claim child benefit for my 2 yr old to make him "exist" on some system where the csa would acknowledge my husband is responsible for my baby too.

Missmouse

Ahhhhhh thank you Honeynut that's where I've gone wrong, I've thought they were asking about the ex wife...which explains the silly amount

kevin137

Missmouse wrote: »

Im wondering if I have to claim child benefit for my 2 yr old to make him "exist" on some system where the csa would acknowledge my husband is responsible for my baby too.

No you wouldn't, they don't even have to be his children in the current household, they could be yours from a previous relationship and would still be taken into account if he is permanently resident at the same address as them...

HoneyNutLoop

Missmouse wrote: »

Im wondering if I have to claim child benefit for my 2 yr old to make him "exist" on some system where the csa would acknowledge my husband is responsible for my baby too.

Yes you would, as it's one part of their criteria for a "relevant other child".
http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_digitalassets/@dg/@en/@benefits/documents/digitalasset/dg_198849.pdf
Page 15 gives more info on that.

However, if you were concerned about being over the threshold for child benefit and being overpaid, you can submit the claim but advise HMRC you don't want to receive the payments. This link should make things clearer:
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/childbenefitcharge/introduction.htm

Missmouse

That link is great and actually reading it, it looks like I'm now eligible!