Bankrupt hit with Income Payments Agreement Advice Please?

arcon5

Come on guys, gettingbackontrack made a very frank but valid point for which we may agree with - but no need to take it too far a jump down ops throat.

As for £30/month holiday... you should certainly negotiate that. A holiday with you + 3 kids i'm thinking maybe £1300-£2000 including necessary expenditure.

gettingbackontrack

arcon5 wrote: »

Come on guys, gettingbackontrack made a very frank but valid point for which we may agree with - but no need to take it too far a jump down ops throat.

As for £30/month holiday... you should certainly negotiate that. A holiday with you + 3 kids i'm thinking maybe £1300-£2000 including necessary expenditure.

No-one is entitled to a holiday. There are plenty of people who are paying back what they owe who can't afford to take their children on holiday.

In my view, £1,300-£2,000 is an obscene amount to spend on a holiday by someone who owes money. Pay back your debts, then spend on luxuries. It really is that simple. I think the OR has been too kind to the original poster - the £30 a month is money that should be included in the IPA, in my view. No holiday till the IPA is completed.

22bear

arcon5 wrote: »

Come on guys, gettingbackontrack made a very frank but valid point for which we may agree with - but no need to take it too far a jump down ops throat.

As for £30/month holiday... you should certainly negotiate that. A holiday with you + 3 kids i'm thinking maybe £1300-£2000 including necessary expenditure.

Well I understood that the OR would consider reasonable £20 per person per month for a holiday, so maybe that's something the OP could try to negotiate £800-900 for an annual holiday for him and his kids (with evidence of course I would hope- I provided evidence with everything I claimed in my SOA for with receipts, letters, etc)..but he did say he wanted £3k to hire a car to drive to France and stay for free with his mother who lives there....even he says that was taking the mick, which kinda speaks for itself I think!

I was bricking it about my IPA, but I can honestly say at no time did I ever consider taking the mick with it!!

debt_doctor

gettingbackontrack wrote: »

No-one is entitled to a holiday. There are plenty of people who are paying back what they owe who can't afford to take their children on holiday.

In my view, £1,300-£2,000 is an obscene amount to spend on a holiday by someone who owes money. Pay back your debts, then spend on luxuries. It really is that simple. I think the OR has been too kind to the original poster - the £30 a month is money that should be included in the IPA, in my view. No holiday till the IPA is completed.

The law looks at it differently.

The provisions for the reasonable domestic needs of the bankrupt certainly allow for the provision of a holiday and whilst the OPs suggestion would not be allowable, the lower end of Arcon5s suggestion would be a reasonable holiday expense.

DD

arcon5

gettingbackontrack wrote: »

No-one is entitled to a holiday. There are plenty of people who are paying back what they owe who can't afford to take their children on holiday.

In my view, £1,300-£2,000 is an obscene amount to spend on a holiday by someone who owes money. Pay back your debts, then spend on luxuries. It really is that simple. I think the OR has been too kind to the original poster - the £30 a month is money that should be included in the IPA, in my view. No holiday till the IPA is completed.

Holiday is an entitlement as far as the SOA is concerned. My receiver allowed a 'holiday' allowance, and many others have stated they was allowed one to.

I accept your point and do agree as far as many people aren't fortunate enough to be able to afford a holiday, but even being the case I don't see why a BR shouldn't be allowed a reasonable quality of life - and disallowing at least a modest but reasonable budget is not just disallowing this (IMO), but is also effectively punishing the children.

I genuinely feel for those paying down their debts unable to afford a holiday, I genuinely do, but we need to take each case individually, and I feel even a BR should be allowed this one thing.

Some people can barely even afford food, but that doesn't mean we should reduce the 'living expense' allowing for a BR.

The receiver has allowed £360 per year, even if this was just doubled to what 22bear suggested, it could still be reasonable for a budget holiday I guess.

Just my opinion anyway, I of course respect the fact you may not agree.

gettingbackontrack

debt_doctor wrote: »

The law looks at it differently.

The provisions for the reasonable domestic needs of the bankrupt certainly allow for the provision of a holiday and whilst the OPs suggestion would not be allowable, the lower end of Arcon5s suggestion would be a reasonable holiday expense.

DD

Well, the law, it was once said, is an !!!.

It's interesting that if I, for example, decided not to pay my council tax and instead spent the £900 on a holiday, the law would take a very dim of that. And quite rightly. We all have responsibilities as members of society to pay our way and not to get a free pass because we don't feel like contributing.

The bankrupt will have left certain organisations or individuals out of pocket due to their bankruptcy. Those organisations shouldn't lose out while the bankrupt goes on a jolly.

I'm quite shocked that £1,300 would be allowed on a holiday. Obviously a reasonable living standard is needed but since when did a holiday become a necessity? There are plenty of people who would love to get a £1,300 reduction on their debts to have a holiday!!

debt_doctor

gettingbackontrack wrote: »

I'm quite shocked that £1,300 would be allowed on a holiday. Obviously a reasonable living standard is needed but since when did a holiday become a necessity? There are plenty of people who would love to get a £1,300 reduction on their debts to have a holiday!!

The Insolvency Act 1986 allows expenditure above necessity. Necessity is not the legal test - and I support it.

Other insolvency methods such as IVAs and DROs allow far higher acceptable expenditure than bankruptcy.

DD

shop-to-drop

The budget the OR suggested would pay for a camping trip closer to home. However I'm sure the grandparents would love to see the children and so hopefully may be prepared to pay travel costs to do so this year.