Is a University degree worth it?

andrewjf

I've been thinking about what advice to give my young daughter (11 years old) about the future. She's bright and doing well at school. I'm pretty sure she can get into Uni, but the sheer expense of doing a University degree these days has made me question whether it's worth it.

I know the value of a good education, it was drilled into me from a young age, and was always my goal to go to Uni. In certain careers, a degree is required, but imagine finishing your course with a substantial debt like that.
I consider myself fortunate in that my degree didn't cost me anything as I got a full grant, and it certainly has helped in my career (IT). However saying that I know a few people in my line of work who don't have degrees, they have a great skillset, confidence, and don't have trouble finding work.

Do you think it's true that not having a degree creates a 'glass ceiling' where you can't progress any further in your career? Probably depends on work area I suppose.

There's also the option of starting your own business, but of course that depends on having a good business idea.

We don't have enough spare money to pay for a degree, and although I'm saving, won't get anywhere near the fees required. One idea we thought of was for her to work a couple of years after finishing A levels to build up some cash. This would also give her good experience of working in the real world.

Any thoughts?

Lagoon

Of course, this is only my opinion, but I think that a university degree is worth it for SOME people. It has to be your daughters decision, and she has to want to do the degree and have her reasons in mind. For some people (including me) it's the right choice. For others (OH and my siblings amongst them), it's not.

The fact is that unless she wants to do a career that specifically needs a certain degree (something she'll have to look into with a career in mind) then she can do just as well without one. HOWEVER, at this time you shouldn't let finances play a part in your decision. Degrees are expensive, but they're covered by loans which don't require paying back until she's earning over a certain amount. Even then, they're more a graduate tax than a crippling loan - just a little out of her paycheck each month. All that said, she's 11 - there are quite a few years in which that situation can change.

For now I'd say forget the financial aspect, but don't get TOO involved with her decision. University will be a complete waste of money (saved or otherwise) if she goes and it's not for her.

[Deleted User]

You know she doesn't start paying fees until she's in a job paying over a certain amount, right?

The right degree from the right uni is still worth it - sadly there's a lot of 'unworthy' degree courses that pollute the graduate market.

claret_mike

I think that there is a long way to go before you need to worry about this.

Ultimately, there will be grants, loans and potential bursaries available to her now if she was of age, a lot do not become repayable until she earns a certain amount.

At 11, I am sure there will be lots of turns in the road to what she wants to do so I would just try and support her the best you can along the way and even if you did have the money to pay, it may not be the smartest way to pay up front.

Re getting a degree? I left school at 16 and have obtained industry relevant qualifications along the way. Without knowing what she wants to do, it may be that a degree is essential - medicine/law for example where she may want to do finance/accountancy where industry specific qualifications can be more useful.

Its a big question with lots of answers and one that I dont think you will answer tbh

andrewjf

Thanks for your balanced views. Yes I'm aware that the fees don't have to be paid back until you earn over a certain threshold, but a main reason for getting a degree is to increase earning power, and so I expect a large proportion of graduates would have to pay it. In any case, it's still a large debt hanging over your head which will at some point have to be repaid as your salary increases.

In terms of thinking about the financial side of things, I don't think it is too early because as you know, investments take a long time to grow, especially as I don't have a lot of disposable income to put away (my Wife doesn't work as we have another 2 year old daughter).
So I am conscious of getting the finance side of things sorted out, even if it just helps her out a little bit.

Mojisola

andrewjf wrote: »

Thanks for your balanced views. Yes I'm aware that the fees don't have to be paid back until you earn over a certain threshold, but a main reason for getting a degree is to increase earning power, and so I expect a large proportion of graduates would have to pay it. In any case, it's still a large debt hanging over your head which will at some point have to be repaid as your salary increases.

As Lagoon says - think of it as a graduate tax rather than a debt.

Have you read Martin's guide - https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/students/student-loans-tuition-fees-changes

Daedalus

It depends on the individual, but in general a degree is still value for money. People get confused that because a degree isn't 'used' in a job that it is useless.

1) Degree does provide skills that are used without realising, the same way basic education does.

2) Many jobs require a degree just to get interviewed as a basic requirment, much like GCSE C in mMaths ad English. Of course you can reach good jobs without a degree or GCSEs, but it is much harder.

[Deleted User]

Educate her about all the options and let her decide. If she wants to do a degree and the value it provides is high enough then taking on the debt is not bad. Debt is fine when it's working for you, debt is only bad when it controls your life. A degree in computer science for example is well worth every penny.

I left school in 2008 and throughout my school life (both primary and high) we were told that there are two choices, either you leave high school and earn minimum wage and be worthless or you attend sixth form, then university to get a degree and become successful with a family and be someone people will like.

For a lot of people further education has a lot of value, for example if you want to be an accountant or a lawyer or work in engineering then a degree will provide the knowledge that is valuable to help succeed in those fields however if you're someone that wants to become an electrician spending 6 years in higher education is a complete waste and puts you at a great disadvantage.

You should educate your daughter about a wide variety of options. For example apprenticeships, entrepreneurial options, volunteering, higher education, a trade, there's so many different options that are available and none of them are permanent. If your daughter leaves school at 16 to work in Asda earning minimum wage for 4 years because that's what makes her happy, so be it, nothing in life is permanent and returning to school when older a valid option. If the most valuable option to her means taking on debt, so be it.

The fact that you're considering this now is a good demonstration of the problem children face, from a young age they're taught that there is only one or two paths available and they're expected to commit to something so young. My brother is 16 years old and about to leave school, when I was 16 I wasn't capable of doing my homework let alone deciding my future, so why we let 16 year olds decide things that will affect the rest of their lives I do not know. That's not to say it's bad that you're thinking about this, it just demonstrates that children are barely out of puberty before the rest of their lives are being considered.

A lot of people I went to school believed that university is the only way to succeed, now a large number of them are in university doing worthless degrees, piling up the debt and getting nothing of value. I left school at 16 and now I pay more tax per year than the average person I went to school with will earn, not because I'm a genius or better than them (I'm not) but because I chose the option that suited me most (an act of defiance that turned out for the better).

Although the world is changing, who knows what the world will be like in 20 years, 20 years ago degrees were cheap and the job market was booming. If I had a child I would be focusing on teaching them life skills and not trying to plan for their educational future. Teach them to be able to work hard, to work with people, to adapt, to be good at learning and listening, to be a good leader, things that will pay off in ways that can't even be imagined and will matter so much more than a degree or GCSEs.

The ultimate problem is setting children up for one goal without regard for how everything is changing, the people I went to school that went to university are graduating in a month or two, for a lot of them they've achieved everything school set up for them to achieve, now what? Where do you go with a degree in hospitality? Retail? They could have started in retail at 16 and been managers making 20k+ by now. They're starting on 12k with 20k owed.

andrewjf

Well some good points there citricsquid. Just to clarify, I'm not deciding her future for her, or committing to a particular path. Far from it, I want her to have all options open. Just that she is academically talented, and likely to go down that route.

You're right, choice of degree is a key factor. I would really have to think hard before embarking on a degree course, and how the qualification could be used.

And yes, I think we push teenagers into higher education too young. At 18/19 I'm not sure you have the maturity to make decisions which will likely affect the rest of your life.

Lizling

Another option is to go and study in another EU country where there aren't any tuition fees. Quite a few countries offer degrees taught in English now, and she'd probably end up fluent in another language too.

I'm not sure that there'd be any help with living costs that way, but unless the situation changes over the next few years it would work out a lot cheaper overall.

[Deleted User]

andrewjf wrote: »

Well some good points there citricsquid. Just to clarify, I'm not deciding her future for her, or committing to a particular path. Far from it, I want her to have all options open. Just that she is academically talented, and likely to go down that route.

My posts aren't very clear this late, I didn't mean to imply you're deciding her future but that the way the education system works at the moment necessitates you taking the time to think about her options and provide her with what you feel is best. In an ideal world it would be entirely up to her, unfortunately because of how young children are when decisions are made your choice is either be an attentive parent and try and help her decide (which leads to your own opinions / experience shaping her decisions) or just ignoring the issue and leaving your daughter to work it out herself, in a system that is not structured to allow that to happen.

Wasn't a criticism of you, it's great that you're thinking about all this. I know I would have loved for my parents to have thought about it more than just telling me I had to get my GCSEs and go to college.