Giving notice.

babyemily

Thank you all again. Today the van went back. The company have said they will pay him if he gives them a breakdown of ALL the work he has done over the past few weeks. This is near impossible. They have agreed the van was in good condition so hopefully they wont say any different. Regarding his bond of £500 - They have said he can have £250 now and the rest in 12 months time. Can they do this? He has never agreed to this. He never signed anything and in all fairness his bond was originally £250, it was only after he questioned the continued deductions that they said they decided to put it up to £500.
Usually everything they say is changed so I am struggling to believe we will get anything.

Phil_68

Hi, how does he normally get his work? Phone call / text/ paperwork/verbal?
Them saying that the van is in good condition is a far cry from getting something in writing AT THE TIME that it is. Did you get photos? were the seats ripped? major scratch down the side? Cracked or broken windscreen or lamps? Sorry for the doom mongering but you should try to cover your back, especially with what you already knew about them.

Was anything in writing regarding the £500? if their normal is £250, have you anything to back up your claim it was £500? As for holding it for 12 months - rubbish, they pay at the termination of contract and final salary.

As you say everything they have said will change - I really hope this turns out better than it sounds it will.

Good luck and stay positive

Phil.

zzzLazyDaisy

Okay he needs to write to them setting out what he believes he is owed (don't forget holiday pay) something like this

Dear Mr [name of manager dealing]

Re: money owed on termination of employment

I refer to earlier correspondence. You have asked for a breakdown of the money I am owed by the company, which is set out below:

Outstanding wages to [insert last date of service] £XXX
Bond (???) £XXX
Holiday pay accrued but not taken £XXX

Total £XXX

Please note I require this sum to be paid into my bank account in cleared funds by [insert date 14 days from date of letter + two days for postage] failing which I will commence legal proceedings for recovery of the money. No further notice will be given.

Yours sincerely

[Name]

Sorry if I have missed this but I don't understand what the Bond is? Was your OH definitely and employee (ie not self employed)? You need to explain this before you finalise the letter, to make sure the claim is properly worded.

If they don't play ball, then you start proceedings in the employment tribunal, you can do this online and at the moment there is no fee for doing this. The claim would be unlawful deduction from wages (note: do not make a breach of contract claim as that is the only time the employer can make a counterclaim in the tribunal and it sounds like this employer will cook up something spurious).

If you do end up having to make a claim to the tribunal, you should also make a complaint about not having a written statement of employment particulars (contract). The employer is required to provide this within two months of starting work, unfortunately there isn't any real sanction for enforcing this UNLESS you make a claim to the tribunal for some other reason, in which case you can 'piggy back' the failure to provide a contract claim onto the original claim. OH might get an extra couple of weeks pay for this, but more importantly, it might encourage the employer to settle the case without going to tribunal.

Phil_68

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

unfortunately there isn't any real sanction for enforcing this UNLESS you make a claim to the tribunal for some other reason, in which case you can 'piggy back' the failure to provide a contract claim onto the original claim.

Hi, can you clarify this point, are you saying that it cannot be a stand alone claim? What if this was brought up before, either during disputes or grievances?

Phil

zzzLazyDaisy

Phil_68 wrote: »

Hi, can you clarify this point, are you saying that it cannot be a stand alone claim?

Yes, exactly that.

It used to be possible to make a complaint to a tribunal against an employer who failed/refused to comply with the legal requirement to provide a written statement of particulars. This could be done during the course of employment if necessary (though it wouldn't make the employee particularly popular).

Now such a claim can only be made as a bolt on to another claim. Given that the majority of tribunal claims are only made after the employment has ended, this is a bit of a toothless sanction.

babyemily

Phil_68 wrote: »

Hi, how does he normally get his work? Phone call / text/ paperwork/verbal?
Them saying that the van is in good condition is a far cry from getting something in writing AT THE TIME that it is. Did you get photos? were the seats ripped? major scratch down the side? Cracked or broken windscreen or lamps? Sorry for the doom mongering but you should try to cover your back, especially with what you already knew about them.

Was anything in writing regarding the £500? if their normal is £250, have you anything to back up your claim it was £500? As for holding it for 12 months - rubbish, they pay at the termination of contract and final salary.

As you say everything they have said will change - I really hope this turns out better than it sounds it will.

Good luck and stay positive

Phil.

Thank you. I know what you are saying about getting something in writing but he didnt. He recorded the conversation without asking thinking that would suffice.

His bond was taken direct from his wages and again there is absolutely nothing in writing. This company seems to avoid the written word.

babyemily

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

Okay he needs to write to them setting out what he believes he is owed (don't forget holiday pay) something like this

Dear Mr [name of manager dealing]

Re: money owed on termination of employment

I refer to earlier correspondence. You have asked for a breakdown of the money I am owed by the company, which is set out below:

Outstanding wages to [insert last date of service] £XXX
Bond (???) £XXX
Holiday pay accrued but not taken £XXX

Total £XXX

Please note I require this sum to be paid into my bank account in cleared funds by [insert date 14 days from date of letter + two days for postage] failing which I will commence legal proceedings for recovery of the money. No further notice will be given.

Yours sincerely

[Name]

Sorry if I have missed this but I don't understand what the Bond is? Was your OH definitely and employee (ie not self employed)? You need to explain this before you finalise the letter, to make sure the claim is properly worded.

If they don't play ball, then you start proceedings in the employment tribunal, you can do this online and at the moment there is no fee for doing this. The claim would be unlawful deduction from wages (note: do not make a breach of contract claim as that is the only time the employer can make a counterclaim in the tribunal and it sounds like this employer will cook up something spurious).

If you do end up having to make a claim to the tribunal, you should also make a complaint about not having a written statement of employment particulars (contract). The employer is required to provide this within two months of starting work, unfortunately there isn't any real sanction for enforcing this UNLESS you make a claim to the tribunal for some other reason, in which case you can 'piggy back' the failure to provide a contract claim onto the original claim. OH might get an extra couple of weeks pay for this, but more importantly, it might encourage the employer to settle the case without going to tribunal.

Thank you for that letter, Its very helpful. My husband started out as a sub contractor but was taken on the books in Jan. He was definitely employed by them. The company are now saying the bond is in case of chargebacks ie: something he done needs to be fixed or redone by another tradesperson.

babyemily

Phil68, He would get a phone call saying what site he had to go to. But he has been on the same site for quite a while sorting it out.

zzzLazyDaisy

babyemily wrote: »

Thank you for that letter, Its very helpful. My husband started out as a sub contractor but was taken on the books in Jan. He was definitely employed by them. The company are now saying the bond is in case of chargebacks ie: something he done needs to be fixed or redone by another tradesperson.

That's why I asked - that sort of bond is for contractors, not employees. However, since he is an employee and they have with-held the bond, then you need to include it in the claim - but all the more reason for confining the claim to unlawful deduction from wages (which is what the bond is - as is also any failure to pay wages/holiday pay). The employer can only deduct money from wages if a) the money is owed and b) the employee has signed a written consent to agree to this. It sounds like, if your OH makes a breach of contract claim, this employer will jump on the bandwagon and come up with all sorts of spurious counterclaims so that is best avoided.

babyemily

Thank you zzzLazyDaisy. Shall I write a letter now? His payday is the 25th. Do I wait till then? Sorry for all the questions.