Help needed wages overpayment...

D&DD

Got a letter today stating OH has been overpaid by just shy of a grand :eek: :eek: :eek:
Royal Mail want £57 a week back due to their own mistake..We cannot afford this.They have paid him a monthly supplement by mistake...for 2 and a half years :rolleyes: He didn't realise he shouldn't be getting it so where do we stand legally,can they demand the £57 a week???or worse still just take it?? Thanks in advance..

Andy_L

Generally (IANAL & all that) if it was:
a) the employers fault
b) reasonable for you to not realise you were being overpaid &
c) you've spent the money

they can't take it back. So it hinges on point b, you need to demonstrate you couldn't easily tell it was an overpayment, eg if it says "London weighting" on the pay slip & you don't work in London you out off luck whilst if it said "Location supplement" you're on firmer ground

Regardless they can't just take it all back in one go

tigtag02

Unfortunately Andy you are wrong

Regardless of fault the OH of the OP has been overpaid and legally the employer can reclaim it.

However you are correct in that they cannot take it all in one go but this is not what they are proposing.

OP - if the £57 a week is too much for you to afford then I suggest that your OH speaks to the payroll or HR dept to negotiate a smaller repayment. I would hinge your argument on the fact that the overpayment is their fault!

Has your OH been receiving this since he started his employment? If not how was it explained when it first began getting paid?

Regards
tigtag

D&DD

The overpayments were made once a month as a supplement on his wages,as a postie they get loads of these bits and pieces and as they dont sit around discussing their money he didn't think anything was amiss.He had no idea it was wrong..all the supplements started 6 months into his employment.This is usual practise we presume???(sorry he's not much help...)

tigtag02

I would speak to the departments I mentioned before to see if he can reduce the repayments.

Good Luck

Jarvisma

The first thing I have noticed is that you say the overpayments were made on a monthly basis, yet the employer has asked for it to be repaid weekly, is this correct?

If your OH is paid on a monthly basis, how are they suggesting he should repay the funds on a weekly basis? or are they suggesting he should pay the appropriate no of weeks each month from his salary?

That is the first area that is a little confusing. The second point is that you don't say exactly how much the overpayment was originally each month. Would you mind letting us know what the overpayments were, then if they differ hugely from the amount and timeframe you being asked to make the repayments you should have a very good case for asking to lower the payments.

I am a payroll & HR manager and have unfortunately seen this happen several times, but when setting a repayment plan I would always be willing to consider any sensible offer of repayment put forward. A sensible offer to me would be to clear the outstanding overpayment over the same period that the original overpayments were made (i.e. 2 1/2 years)

However, I would advise that you speak to CAB or a legal representative quickly and before you agree any offer of payment. Due to the fact that the overpayment has been so long term, and has been occurring since very early in the employment, you may be able to argue that you were led to believe that you were entitled to it. But that isn't my area of expertise and if you are going to look into that you should do so asap so that if you are advised you don't have a case and will have to repay in full you still have time to negotiate a lower repayment figure.

Don't forget that you will also have an internal grievance procedure that I would advise taking full advantage of. If you make an official complaint, any repayments should be frozen until the matter has been resolved.

PM me if you would rather not give the actual details on here and I would be happy to see if I could be of any more help but otherwise keep us posted!

D&DD

Sorry for the confusion OH disappeared while I was trying to sort it out for him :rolleyes: In answer to your questions he is paid weekly and they get the supplements weekly or monthly depending on which ones they are..
The amount was approx £40 a month each time (this one was paid once a month, not each week) See clear as mud Thanks for your help he's got the union involved today so hopefully we'll be able to work something out as you can see from our sig theres not a lot of spare cash about at present!!

B.W._Fox

£57 a week is too much and is honestly unfair. It is reasonable, as you said, that he didn't realise that he was being overpaid - especially as it seemed to be hard to know exactly what every supplement to his pay was.

I was overpaid. Yes, you do have to pay it back if they ask for it. But repayment is down to circumstances and since you can't possibly afford £57/wk, tell them: a) this is your fault and b) I can afford to give you £xx per month, no more.

This is interest-free repayment, BTW - if they make a fuss, employment law is on your side.

I was able to name my terms. I pay £20/month on a £2168 overpayment, and could delay a month if needed. So long as you pay it all back, they have no right to demand anything else.

We all know the Royal Mail could use a few bob and now we know exactly how they got into that mess - if they overpay their employees, you can bet they have overpaid suppliers too.

B

Jarvisma

I would say that if their original overpayment was £40 per month it is not unreasonable to repay it at £40 per month (or the equivalent weekly value).

You should point out, and they should take into account, that from now on you are obviously going to be £40 worse of than you had been allowed to get used to over the last 2 and a half years (this will remind them that they only have themselves to blame) and that furthermore as you are willing to repay that same amount you will actually be £40 a month worse of than you should be under normal circumstances as well.

As long as your OH is willing to sign an agreement that he is happy to have this amount deducted each month / week and there is no immediate reason to believe he will be leaving his employment any reasonable employer would agree to this.

If they don't, make a formal complaint and see through the grievance procedure.

If they do agree however I would advise you the same as I have advised others - keep track of the repayments, ensure they are being taken, and once the full amount has been repayed, make sure they stop! If mistakes can happen one way round they can also happen in the reverse and to overpay someone for 2 and a half years without realising means they must have some serious shortcomings in the organisation of their payroll department.

One final point I would make is to make sure that you are repaying the NET overpayment and not the GROSS, as if the £40 was before tax and NI, you will have obviously paid tax and NI on this amount and the net you will have recieved will have been less. Because this period spans more than one tax year you will need to make sure you are getting the full benefit of any refund of tax and NI you may be due. If you are in any doubt about whethr this is being done correctly, contact HMRC (used to be Inland Revenue) and ask them to look into the situation. Any employer recovering an overpayment which originally spanned more than 1 tax year is obliged to contact HMRC and it is in your interest to make sure they do. (And the Revenue love a whistleblower!) Just think, if they have done this to you, they could have done it to any number of people and may have got the tax and NI due wrong as well, this HMRC would be extremely interested in.

Good luck and keep us posted. Don't let them intimidate you!

LittleVoice

Jarvisma wrote: »

You should point out, and they should take into account, that from now on you are obviously going to be £40 worse of than you had been allowed to get used to over the last 2 and a half years . . . furthermore as you are willing to repay that same amount you will actually be £40 a month worse of than you should be under normal circumstances as well.

Nice point - £80/month less than had become used to expect.