Criminal records to "drop off"

MTDancer

So some criminal records will "drop off" the system but if you are bankrupt it never goes away.

Under the proposed legislation, convictions resulting in a non-custodial sentence will be filtered from record checks after 11 years for adults and five and a half years for young offenders.

Cautions will be filtered from record checks by the Disclosure and Barring Service (DBS), formerly known as the Criminal Records Bureau, after six years for adults and two years for young offenders

Fine, but let bankruptcy "disappear" after 6 years then..

2kadmin

Hi,

Im interested, where should they drop off from?

They go from your credit file after six years (assuming you've kept the same one)

They disappear from the insolvency register three months after discharge.

Even the land registry only shows them for five years based on a k16 search.

The only thing that bugs me a little is the London Gazette thing, I wonder if they fall foul of the data protection act as the data they hold is outdated?

I think the banks are perfectly entitled to ask if you have ever been declared bankrupt the same way employers would still be able to ask if you have ever been convicted of a criminal offence. The fact that neither can prove it one way or the other is only going the lead to the phasing out of this question it just unlikely during my lifetime.

lilybankrupt

Ah but the thing is, with jobs / banks etc you only have to declare a criminal offence that is 'unspent'.

Whereas with bankruptcy the question can be asked 'have you EVER been bankrupt'.

So commit an offence in your 20's you can put it behind you completely after x amount of years, whereas go BR in your 20's you'll still be declaring it 40 years later.

My own view is that BR should also be considered 'spent' after x years - 6 would be great but even 10 would be OK.

Johno100

2kadmin wrote: »

The only thing that bugs me a little is the London Gazette thing, I wonder if they fall foul of the data protection act as the data they hold is outdated?

But the London Gazette is a newspaper, admittedly a freely searchable one. Using the criminal analogy, you wouldn't expect a newspaper to continually review stories in its archive and remove reference to those where the convicted individuals punishment is spent.

MTDancer

2kadmin wrote: »

Hi,

Im interested, where should they drop off from?

They go from your credit file after six years (assuming you've kept the same one)

They disappear from the insolvency register three months after discharge.

Even the land registry only shows them for five years based on a k16 search.

The only thing that bugs me a little is the London Gazette thing, I wonder if they fall foul of the data protection act as the data they hold is outdated?

I think the banks are perfectly entitled to ask if you have ever been declared bankrupt the same way employers would still be able to ask if you have ever been convicted of a criminal offence. The fact that neither can prove it one way or the other is only going the lead to the phasing out of this question it just unlikely during my lifetime.

It is not just the banks that ask the question: insurance companies, references for renting properties, anyone you want to pay monthly to. I have a good credit record since bankruptcy, all bills have been paid on time, I have a credit card which is paid in full every month, I have an account with Virgin Media which is paid on time every month but I could not pay £10 a month for car insurance because I have been bankrupt in the past!

2kadmin

Well I am suprised,

I have pretty much lied on a lot of forms then, it's been four years and six months for me, I have several credit cards and a loan I have had for a year, I don't really remember any of the credit applications, even for a fancy black Amex card, just filled then out and sent them off!

Although thinking about it I paid my partners car insurance up front for the year.

Everything is paid on time in full.

However, my credit file makes no mention of my previous history, I'm all clear in all respects and expect to qualify for the best mortgage deals with the 10% deposit I have managed to save as soon as my five year 'term' is up.

Why am i not worried? Well the all the financial insitiutions choose to allow it in my opinion. They could simply ask for a national insurance number, a number that pretty much everyone has and would virtually wipe out money laundering in one fell swoop. But they don't, why? Well there is only one answer I can think of.

MTDancer

I know you will need a lot bigger deposit than 10% as an ex bankrupt and when your solicitor does a search your bankruptcy WILL show up.

2kadmin

Hi,

Sorry but you are mistaken, the k16 search your solicitor carries out is based on land registry records, whilst these never expire the £2 search only searches for the past five years.

I know this as my niece is a solicitor, but a quick google of k16 will tell you the same.

Hope this might give you some hope.

MTDancer

well, I am sorry but all of the solicitors I know do a bankruptcy charge. And ALL mortgage applications ask if you have been bankrupt and if you do not answer YES you are breaking the law. Good luck, for your sake, I hope you are correct

2kadmin

Well I'm fairly certain a charge search is against the property you are purchasing, and as I said the £2 'bankruptcy search' only goes back five years.

Yes, I intend to lie on my application if I have too, but I am fairly certain I won't have too as my bank are all to keen to fill out forms for me, and brokers generally are willing to say anything to get there money. I wouldn't advise anyone else to do this as I said its fraud, I know this and I'm willing to take the risk.

If everyone really lives under this cloud then I actually agree with the OP, we should change the law to make bankruptcy seen as 'spent' after a certain amount if time, meaning you shouldn't be obliged to declare it if asked.

fiveyearplan

Not all mortgage applications ask if you have 'ever' been bankrupt.