Council Tax Band challenge

C.TaxBemused

Hi all, first post

I'm trying to challenge my council tax band.

My main challenge point (I think) is I bought my home in the same month as the house next door but one. We paid the same amount in June 2006 (£250,000 Essex), although my house is a 4bed 3 storey, and that one is a 3bed 2 storey.

My main point is if we paid the same amount in the same month (both new builds, from the same national builder) surely we should be the same band? I am a band higher (E).

According to the MSE Calculator I should be Band D.

There are 5x 3bed 3 storey opposite me (but different name street) that all sold for same or higher (In Oct & Nov 2006 same new build, same developer) that are same band as me.

There are only 2 other houses the same as mine on the estate (300 houses) that sold (£212,995 July 2009) and (£209,000 Sept 2009) they are Band E also.

I called the VOA, expecting to be visited or asked for written eveidence, but I received a letter the other day, stating I am in the correct band and that I cannot appeal (although my research seems to think I can? To the independent tribunal?)

Any thoughts? Help? Advise?

Thanks in advance

lincroft1710

C.TaxBemused wrote: »

There are 5x 3bed 3 storey opposite me (but different name street) that all sold for same or higher (In Oct & Nov 2006 same new build, same developer) that are same band as me.

There are only 2 other houses the same as mine on the estate (300 houses) that sold (£212,995 July 2009) and (£209,000 Sept 2009) they are Band E also.

This would suggest that Band E may be correct. Try to find any similar size houses not on your estate, but nearby which are in Band D

You are only entitled to a Tribunal hearing if you appeal within 6 months of becoming the Council Taxpayer.

C.TaxBemused

lincroft1710 wrote: »

This would suggest that Band E may be correct. Try to find any similar size houses not on your estate, but nearby which are in Band D

You are only entitled to a Tribunal hearing if you appeal within 6 months of becoming the Council Taxpayer.

Or that they are in the wrong band too??

the MSE Calculator suggests we all should be Band D.

Surely, it's strong evidence that if my house sold in the same month at the same price as a property next door but one then I am in the wrong band? Price must be the strongest evidence?

I thought the 6 month thing had been over ruled by the Government?

Yes, I was right:

Can't post the link. this website then news then

Council tax rebanding hope as Government pushes to end incorrect 'six-month rule'

My understanding is you can appeal within 3 months of the VOA decision.

lincroft1710

What matters is what the 1991 price would have been for a similar size 4 bed house and without knowing that it's not possible to say with certainty whether or not the band is incorrect. The evidence you offer gives more support for a Band E than a Band D, and there is a possibility that the Band D house could be in the wrong band.

The 6 month rule has not been "overruled" by the government, the VOA will investigate the band at any time and have always done so. But only if you appeal within the 6 months can you go to a Tribunal.

It states this in Brandon Lewis' letter :

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/175462/130304-Appeals_3.pdf

If the government wants to abolish the 6 month rule, all it has to do is make a Statutory Instrument, plenty of which have been made regarding CT since the 1992 Local Government Finance Act came into force bringing CT into being.

C.TaxBemused

lincroft1710 wrote: »

What matters is what the 1991 price would have been for a similar size 4 bed house and without knowing that it's not possible to say with certainty whether or not the band is incorrect. The evidence you offer gives more support for a Band E than a Band D, and there is a possibility that the Band D house is in the wrong band.

The 6 month rule has not been "overruled" by the government, the VOA will investigate the band at any time and have always done so. But only if you appeal within the 6 months can you go to a Tribunal.

It states this in Brandon Lewis' letter :



If the government wants to abolish the 6 month rule, all it has to do is make a Statutory Instrument, plenty of which have been made regarding CT, since the 1992 Local Government Finance Act came into force bringing CT into being.

I've already stated twice that the calculator on this very website suggests I should be in Band D.

Regarding the other property, I think it extremely unlikely that a bog standard 3bed modern box built by a national builder would be Band E!

As to the highlighted stuff:

From this very website:

Households who try to get their council tax band lowered have been given a boost after the Government said it will push the Valuation Office Agency (VOA) to consider appeals no matter when they are made. Currently, many people are wrongly turned away if they appeal more than six months after moving in.

And from the Tribunal site:

Council Tax Valuation


An appeal against a decision made by the Valuation Office Agency Listing Officer about the entry of a property in the valuation list. If you disagree with that decision, for example, because you feel you are in the wrong council tax band or that your property should not be in the valuation list, you must make an appeal within three months of the date you received their decision notice. Please remember to send us a copy of the ‘Decision of the VOA Listing Officer’. We will not be able to accept your appeal without it.

lincroft1710

C.TaxBemused wrote: »

I've already stated twice that the calculator on this very website suggests I should be in Band D.

Calculators are not 100% accurate.

Regarding the other property, I think it extremely unlikely that a bog standard 3bed modern box built by a national builder would be Band E!

I'm ex VOA and saw plenty of small 3 beds with en suite in Band E, and you state the 3 bed opposite are in Band E .

As to the highlighted stuff:

From this very website:

Households who try to get their council tax band lowered have been given a boost after the Government said it will push the Valuation Office Agency (VOA) to consider appeals no matter when they are made. Currently, many people are wrongly turned away if they appeal more than six months after moving in.

Still does not alter the 6 months time limit for making an appeal which can be taken to Tribunal. All it says is that they want the VOA to look at any request for a band reduction. Which is precisely what I was doing for 12 of my 35 years in the VOA, dealing with valid appeals and out of time band reduction requests. And I reuced quite a few of the latter.

And from the Tribunal site:

Council Tax Valuation


An appeal against a decision made by the Valuation Office Agency Listing Officer about the entry of a property in the valuation list. If you disagree with that decision, for example, because you feel you are in the wrong council tax band or that your property should not be in the valuation list, you must make an appeal within three months of the date you received their decision notice. Please remember to send us a copy of the ‘Decision of the VOA Listing Officer’. We will not be able to accept your appeal without it.

This refers to when an appeal has been made to the VOA within the 6 months time limit, the taxpayer has 3 months from date of VO decision not to reduce the band to appeal to the Tribunal.

As I said in my previous post , it is a very simple matter for the government to pass legislation to completely abolish 6 month rule and make it possible for an appeal with a right to Tribunal hearing to be made at any time. The question you should be asking is why don't they ?

clare64

Lincroft,
I wonder if you would mind commenting on our situation please?
We bought our house in 2002, however 5 years before we bought it, part of the garden was sold as a building plot and a house was built on it.
I contacted the valuation people last week and advised that I thought we were in the wrong band ( according to Martins calculator).the valuer
asked me how big our garden was ( he could see the plans of our house) I told him and it appears that the banding was not changed in 1997 even though the value of the property had gone down.
So, if there are changes to a house that lowers the value, after 1991, would this mean that the band should have changed or would it stay with the value of the house as it was in 1991. When I asked the valuer he did not know and has referred it.
I hope this makes sense!
Clare

lincroft1710

Clare

In theory anything which affects the value of a property should be reflected in its CT band.

However it is very rare for a CT band to be reduced because some of the garden has been sold off. The VOA do not usually have details of garden size and it did not feature in the calculation of the vast majority of CT bands. Of course if the band did specifically reflect the garden size then it should be recalculated.

If the present garden size is considered adequate or normal for the type and size of house and the band is in line with others of same type and size, it is very doubtful there would be a band reduction.

But what is important is whereabouts in the band the value of the house was before the garden was sold. From memory in 1991 the proportion of a property's value attributable to the garden wasn't great, so in terms of loss of value, it may only be a few thousand, if that, and may not be sufficient to bring the value into a lower band.

BTW even though the original garden clearly had potential as a building plot, the rules on banding do not allow this to be reflected in the band.

C.TaxBemused

lincroft1710 wrote: »

As I said in my previous post , it is a very simple matter for the government to pass legislation to completely abolish 6 month rule and make it possible for an appeal with a right to Tribunal hearing to be made at any time. The question you should be asking is why don't they ?

Thanks for, again, ignoring my points.

And, it seems, trying to deflect your poor responses away from yourself.

lincroft1710

C.TaxBemused wrote: »

Thanks for, again, ignoring my points.

And, it seems, trying to deflect your poor responses away from yourself.

I could say the same to you, but as you are a newbie and one should be kind to newbies, I won't.

My responses are not "poor" just because you don't agree with them. I am well aware of your points, but as regards the banding issue you have been unable to convince the VOA. Your options are limited, I suggested you try to find other similar size 4 beds in Band D, and if you can you can go back to VOA with this info.

With regard to the appeal issue. If you believe the recent government pronouncement now entitles a CT payer to make an appeal at any time, just ring up the VOA on Tuesday and ask them if this is so.

I'm sorry if you don't think I've been helpful, but this will be my last word on the subject.

clare64

Lincroft,
Many thanks for such a through and detailed reply.
From what you are saying we might not get our property rebanded, but,ever the optimist, I will see what their referral comes back with
Thank you,again.
Clare