will contesting advice please

lswwong

Good to see Graham back!

(He gave advice previously on no win no fee queries which were very good. I respect his advice.)

Nothing like money matters after someone's death to bring the worst out of people. This point has been echoed throughout this thread.

Just on a purely for information basis, it is possible to get a sort of Deed of Variation by common agreement between the heirs after a will has been read out - sorry I have not touched probate matters since 1997! This is a situation where a will has been read out, and the heirs agree between themselves that a revised "distribution" or what have you would suit everyone better. For example, if A is getting £X and a house and thinks it would be better if B gets the house i.e. forgoing A's entitlement to the house because they think it would be fairer, then by agreement the particular provisions of the will are revised. (Graham - please yell if I get this wrong or am out of date with current legislation/case law!!) This is a complicated legal process and requires a court order i.e. HASSLE.

I tend to agree with the others that unless your parents have a change of heart, it is probably best to stay out of this issue altogether and have your peace of mind. :-/

Things got very ugly on my mother's side when her older sister, who was wealthy, died. My mum's younger sister, who is very dotty, dealt with the probate with little help from the other siblings (my mother wasn't much help as she lives in another country). To give the dotty aunt credit, she did her best, under the circumstances. Then another aunt by marriage, who didn't help at all, argues that the dotty aunt didn't sell some shares in the most financially advantageous way and kicked up a massive stink. To this day, none of them are talking to one another. They simply fell out over someone's else's money, a dead one at that.

It makes me shudder sometimes.

Hold on to your dignity ..... is that a good/okay way of putting it?

Best wishes,
Lou

GCooper

Great to be back. I stopped posting as I didn't want everyone to think that I was using this as an angle for getting work and didn't want to run the risk of turning Martin's pages into a free advice page. However, I am happy to chip in with input on threads from time to time, if I can help.

A deed of variation is possible to alter people's entitlements under wills. Although it is not strictly my territory, it is often used where, for example, a beneficiary has a mental incapacity which means that they really can't handle the money. They can be extremely tricky things and have all sorts of tax and benefit implications, which is particularly important these days where Inheritance Tax is often signifcant as a result of rising house prices. I would always recommend getting a solicitor to deal with this for you.

Contesting an estate can be fiendishly difficult and hideously expensive and is not to be undertaken lightly. The costs nearly always outweigh the benefits. My general advice is to get expert advice.

lswwong

Graham, it is so good to have you back. Your presence and opinions are reassuring and valued.

When probate matters become contentious, it is absolutely necessary to draft in qualified legal help i.e. pay lawyers lots of money. This is a complicate area of law, particularly when contentious. As Graham said, the costs far outweigh the benefits.

Hand on my heart, the pressures, anxiety and scariness of going through the whole pulaver of lawyers, barristers, hostile parties, going to the High Court etc are just not worth it!! (Guaranteed to age you in no time at all!)

lizzie1972

Hi

Just wanted to say a big thank you to everyone who has posted advice on here for me.

I had pretty much resigned myself to the fact that there is nothing I can do about it, the story runs far more deeper that I have gone into, but just wanted to see if there was any point in persuing the matter.

Unfortunately my parents are of sound mind, they are just doing it to be incredibly spiteful (if the correct terminology) because I don't think the way they do and because I got in contact with my dads side of the family (with their permission) whom I had never met in 32 years, needless to say my sister wanted none of it and perhaps this is why they have done it. Who know's.

The reason I am so annoyed is that my parents are now worth over 1m, and we went without when we were young so that they coulkd sit on all their money!!!!, yes I'm bitter who wouldn't be. This is why I feel I should be entitled to something at least.

But at the end of the day she has got the upper hand yet again.

Cheers Lizzie

lswwong

Oh so sorry to hear about the sorry state of affairs ...

Y'know, what comes round, goes round. All that hurt will get back to them one day. Let's see if they like it then? People who think they can take the pi** out of other people's lives using money are a bunch of saddos. Who knows? They might lose it all one day over nothing? In any event, they can't take it with them!!

Isn't it at leaat a little reassuring to know that a big chunk of it will be taken off in inheritance tax?

All the best.

lisyloo

People who think they can take the pi** out of other people's lives using money are a bunch of saddos.

I find this a rather strange attitude.

This is someone else's money you are talking about.
They are entitled to do with it as they wish.

I don't think you have any right to comment on the use of someone else's money (with the exception of illegal activity) least of all someone that you don't know at all.

No-one has any entitlement to someone else money.

I am sympathetic to the original poster and I understand how it would hurt, but morally it is presumptuous at least to assume that someone is going to give you money.

Legally or morally you have no entitlement to it at all unless you are a dependent in which case they have a responsibility towards you.

lswwong

Lisyloo - you have rather over-reacted over my comment, and took offence where none was meant. I have not presumed to judge. Rather, it was a personal observation. You are entitled to your views, of course.

I hope you will reconsider your reply.

Spendless

Lizzie

money isn't everything. If you've been taught to play fair with your own two children as an example. I think that's worth a lot more than inheriting a lot of money.
And keep coming on site, if you put into practise all these tips you might one day have your own million. ;D
All the best

Spendless

lisyloo

I have not taken any offence

I stand by what I said.
Morally in my view no-one is entitled to assume they can have someone elses money.
Legally that is entirely factual (unless dependent as stated).

You are entitled to your opinion about the morals and I am not offended by other people's opinions

However the legal facts are a statement and not an opinion, so the British legal system at least agrees with me that you have no entitlement to someone else's money (unless dependent).

I have no problem with others having different opinions to my own about the morals of it but I still find it strange that people think they have some sort of entitlement over things that aren't theirs.

GCooper

Lizzie

It is very easy for people on the outside to sit in judgement without knowing all of the facts. I think that we can all appreciate how upset you must feel. There is nothing wrong with feeling upset at an injustice. It may be the case that there are things that can be done following your parents death, but you must be prepared to move quickly as you will only have 6 months from the date of the grant of probate (the document issued to give your parent's executors the right to administer the estate). The Inheritance Act is a funny piece of law which would allow you, as a child to challenge the will if no provision is made for you. However, your entitlement may be uncertain and the Court would look to see whether the provision that has been made for you is such as it would be reasonable in all the circumstances of the case for you to receive for your maintenance. This will involve a consideration of you background and the history of your case together with consideration of your circumstances.

This is extremely complex and you should not be put off seeking advice through fear of cost or what anyone else might think. The law is there to protect you, although it might not often look that way. Had Parliament, who were elected by us, not thought that you had rights which needed protecting and which it was morally right for you to pursue, then they would not have created the laws to protect you.

Nevertheless, contested probate actions are costly and difficult, not only financially and legally, but also emotionally. If it is possible, before their deaths to work through these issues with your family, then please keep trying. However, litigation rarely ever results in anyone being happy. It can be draining and take over your life in an awful way. Don't give them the satisfaction of letting this happen to you and don't let this ruin your life.