Government must do more on affordable housing

shortchanged_2

wotsthat wrote: »

Taylor Wimpey paid an average of £33k for their plots. (2011 accounts)

Any idea what they were paying for plots back in 2006, 2007?

the_flying_pig

wotsthat wrote: »

Measuring against peaks and troughs usually isn't that enlightening. If you look at the BoE's trends in lending http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publications/Documents/other/monetary/trendsjanuary13.pdf

Chart 1.4 show lending to individuals over time. It's clear that the measures intended to provide a boost have had limited (if any) impact. That's not because peak lending hasn't yet been achieved but because lending has remained flat despite the schemes you listed.

You can't say lending has been boosted because it would have been lower without the stimulus. For a start builders aren't going to build extra houses because there would have been even less money without the boost and secondly it's difficult to measure what lending would have been without the stimulus so becomes subject to opinion rather than data.

that's a useful chart but the problem is that it only goes back as far as 2007. i'm much more interested in comparing current lending with some kind of measure of 'normal' lending, whatever the heck that might mean than with the absolute peak of a bubble.

wotsthat

shortchanged wrote: »

Any idea what they were paying for plots back in 2006, 2007?

Maybe it's time for you to look something up. You mentioned £100k in an earlier post - presumably that wasn't plucked from thin air?

shortchanged_2

wotsthat wrote: »

Maybe it's time for you to look something up. You mentioned £100k in an earlier post - presumably that wasn't plucked from thin air?

Yes it was plucked out of the air as an example wotsthat.

I have no idea what the average plot price is.

Harry_Boyle

Shortchanged never backs up his arguments. He can't figure out google, that's why he is so wrong about most fo the stuff he spouts - he simply can't research anything and so he just makes it up.

shortchanged_2

Harry_Boyle wrote: »

Shortchanged never backs up his arguments. He can't figure out google, that's why he is so wrong about most fo the stuff he spouts - he simply can't research anything and so he just makes it up.

You appear to know me very well for someone who has only been on here for 3 weeks.

Are you sure you haven't been on here longer?

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

shortchanged wrote: »

Any idea what they were paying for plots back in 2006, 2007?

Doesn't matter.

The average book value is still 33K per plot, if that's what is currently being paid for comparable plots You probably didn't notice but the builders all took big write downs on their accounts when land values fell. A big part of their stock price falling through the floor in 2008/9.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

shortchanged wrote: »

Are you for real Hamish?

Seeing as the price of land is the essential driver of house prices as it is that which is the most volatile aspect of house prices, how can you say that there would be very little price drop in a new build if average plot prices dropped from say £100K to 50K?

The average newbuild is around 180K to 200K.

The average plot cost for housebuilders, as pointed out earlier in the thread, is around 33K.

If land prices fell 50%, the savings would be minimal, in most of the country.

This whole LVT thing is just another discredited hpc meme.

shortchanged_2

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

The average newbuild is around 180K to 200K.

The average plot cost for housebuilders, as pointed out earlier in the thread, is around 33K.

If land prices fell 50%, the savings would be minimal, in most of the country.

This whole LVT thing is just another discredited hpc meme.

OK fine. What I don't get is why does it cost so much more to build a house these days than say 12 years ago?

I know there is the green factors which add some cost, but honestly where does the rest of the phenomenal rise in build cost come from?

Back in 2000 you could buy a new build 4 or 5 bedroom luxury build house for around £120,000 round my way. And one has to assume that the developer is still making money on this. So question is, how were they able to build so cheaply only 10 odd years ago bearing in mind income levels are now said to be back to almost those levels?

grizzly1911

shortchanged wrote: »

Any idea what they were paying for plots back in 2006, 2007?

Since the end of 2003 we have increased focus on buying more medium term land, generally larger pieces of land that will be developed within three to five years, where we can add value by taking the site through the planning system ourselves.
We are already seeing some of the benefits of these types of acquisitions coming through as the plot cost in the landbank starts to reduce.
At the end of 2006 the average plot cost in the landbank was £47,300 compared with that on completions of £49,100.

http://plc.taylorwimpey.co.uk/investorrelations/reportaccounts/georgewimpeyarchive/2006/