An IFA who knows Monkey with a Pin

mj62mj62

Hello,

I recently allocated part of my pension into a SIPP but require advice on what to purchase.

I also recently read Monkey with a Pin which is an amazing ebook by Pete Comley, exposing a lot of things about the financial sector.

I'm very distrusting of the financial industry as a whole and would like to find an IFA who has read the book fully.

Every IFA I've spoken to so far just seems to tow the standard line about diversity - a bit of this and a bit of that. They give bland answers and seem to have no opinions of their own.

Can anyone recommend an IFA who is the "real deal"? Someone intelligent? Someone who has read the book and can discuss the topic intelligently?

I appreciate that forum rules may prevent people posting their answers, so I'm happy to discuss here but would appreciate a private message with any recommendations.

Thanks,
Matt

Lokolo

Pretty sure its unlikely, sure they may have read the book but I don't see why someone would want to deal with a customer who thinks they know better.

(not saying you do, and I'm not saying that IFAs will only deal with financial iliterate, but it would be difficult to be an IFA and have a customer relationship if they question everything you do based on a book)

I'm a little confused as to why you don't DIY, you clearly believe everything in the book so why not learn how to actually invest yourself?

dunstonh

I'm very distrusting of the financial industry as a whole and would like to find an IFA who has read the book fully.

Why would an IFA wont to read his book? What makes him so special?

Every IFA I've spoken to so far just seems to tow the standard line about diversity - a bit of this and a bit of that. They give bland answers and seem to have no opinions of their own.

Of course IFAs have opinions. Some would say we have too many. However, in a quick free of charge conversation you are not going to get a lot of detail. Plus, most IFAs do not use their own in-house allocations but buy in the data and research because that is the best way to do it.

Can anyone recommend an IFA who is the "real deal"? Someone intelligent? Someone who has read the book and can discuss the topic intelligently?

IFAs have to do due diligence and have the data to support their recommendations. A monkey who writes a book to make from does not. You either accept the service that particular IFA has or you move to another. I very much doubt that book would tell an IFA something they do not already know and it certainly would not satisfy due diligence and research requirements.

If the book is that good, then why do you need an IFA?

mj62mj62

Hi Lokolo,

In general, I see what you're saying, but no, I'm not looking to 'question everything they do' :-)

The book is popular and the more research I do the more I see it mentioned. It's a short book - a knowledgeable IFA would read it in a short time.

I'll expand on your points below, but in short, I just want a fantastic IFA - Ideally someone really bright. With the book's popularity, I don't know why an IFA would be adverse to reading it.


1. The relationship with the IFA

I believe a relationship is possible with an IFA in which the customer is financially literate. This book exposes many things and most importantly, encourages customers to make their own intelligent decisions because the industry is filled with people lining their own pockets, including many IFA's (namely those on commissions who aren't encouraged to question 'the system').

I'm reaching out hoping to find someone who has read what I have read, and with whom I can have an intelligent discussion. My questions are about the best strategy, not about questioning them or picking a fight. The book is short and well written - it seems a reasonable request.

So far, I've had back luck. My 2 IFA's seem nothing more than glorified sales people with no opinions on anything such as the Bond Bubble, the FTSE direction, average maturity of bond funds, alternative SIPP investments, good sources of information, just to name a few.

I have some strategies in mind, but would like to sound them off of someone that is worth paying for.

2. DIY

I have 2 pensions and one is taking a very traditional route.

The other is in a SIPP and even having read this information and invested some time, I need further assistance to clarify things and for discussion. I think good advice is part of a DIY/SIPP solution.

That good advice should include guidance on what to look for, what websites to use, etc.

My current IFA's seemed to have memorized a few things off a few courses. The 'find an IFA' websites don't allow you to post requests, so I thought I'd post here.


Whether they've read the book or not, if you have someone exceptional please private message me. Thanks :-)

UsernameAlreadyExists

I quite like the book title, as it made me smirk.
I might even read it later.

Jack_Griffin

Like it, I've downloaded the audio version.

mj62mj62

Hi dunstonh,

The book is fantastic :-) After doing so much research myself, it was a breath of fresh air amongst a sea of self-vested articles on there on the internet.

It's not a big book - why not read it and share your opinion? :-)


You asked why I need an IFA - namely because in doing a SIPP, I want to double check all of my choices with someone who I think is really impressive. Someone with knowledge and someone who can discuss the issues of today.

I need to sound-out both individual choices and my overall strategy. My sipp is a lump sum transferred from a company pension - exactly what I do could make a massive difference in returns.

The book strongly encourages investors to learn the facts and make intelligent choices - not to replace IFA's. (did you take offence?)


I have an IFA who has helped me with financial products over the years, she is lovely and friendly, but she isn't interested in discussing the market and tbh, doesn't seem to have the knowledge about topics like the bond bubble.

I believe whole heartedly in her ability to find me great life insurance and mortgage rates, however like most commission-funded IFA's, I see no encouragement for them to question 'the system'.


So I tried someone else, wasn't impressed with him either.


Now I'm posting here. Someone must have a fantastic IFA. Someone who keeps up with the times, and therefore would automatically notice this book being mentioned so frequently, and therefore read it.

It doesn't seem such a grand request to expect an IFA who is more than a glorified sales person or someone who doesn't just repeat mantras like 'more bonds if you're conservative, more risk can equal more gain', etc. What is now isn't a good time for bonds? I want someone really excellent - in fact, your hostile response of "what makes this guy so special" as if no one should be questioning the industry is the very type of person I want to avoid.

The author has done a ton of research and given his book away for free. That alone makes him more special than most...

Lokolo

I haven't read it but I believe it's the same concept as Tim Hale's book in that it is very passive focused.

OP, I'm not going against you but I think you will find it VERY hard to find an IFA. You basically want an IFA who has the same view as you. And I know you say you won't question the IFA but you will, every single detail. As a software developer I would hate someone over my shoulder watching my code and questioning, discussing my views because they once created a website when they were 13.

You may find PMing some passive investors (gadgetmind is usually helpful and nice) with a link to this thread and get his view.

IFAs aren't there to predict the markets. That's the problem you are going to have. They can give you a selection of investments based on asset allocation and your attitude towards risk, they cannot say "I think gold is going to be the one this year, I think you should go 90% in this" that is what DIYing and forums like Motley Fool are for. Or wealth management and private banking. And even then its difficult to talk to you without signed agreement that you know what you are talking about (and reading one book doesn't count).

mj62mj62

Lokolo wrote: »

IFAs aren't there to predict the markets. That's the problem you are going to have. They can give you a selection of investments based on asset allocation and your attitude towards risk, they cannot say "I think gold is going to be the one this year, I think you should go 90% in this" that is what DIYing and forums like Motley Fool are for. Or wealth management and private banking. And even then its difficult to talk to you without signed agreement that you know what you are talking about (and reading one book doesn't count).

Hi Lokolo,

I think you make an excellent point there. Perhaps my expectations are too high?

Are you saying there is no one with whom I can discuss (using your example) the direction of the price of gold, perhaps given a caveat like "if the FTSE drops to 4000 where do you think gold will go?"

Lokolo wrote: »

I haven't read it but I believe it's the same concept as Tim Hale's book in that it is very passive focused.

I'm not sure what passive focused means, but if anything, he is asking customers to get their head out of the sand and look at things that are eating away their investment returns.

Lokolo wrote: »

You basically want an IFA who has the same view as you. And I know you say you won't question the IFA but you will, every single detail. As a software developer

I too am a software developer and i really enjoy the banter with a fellow geek over the most elegant, getting the most performance, supportability etc.

If I'm paying them by the hour talk about topics they love, why would they be adverse to that? I'd feel more comfortable with someone who has read this as it highlights numerous mis-information coming out of the industry that I need to avoid.

Linton

I am not an IFA...

I fear you have a misunderstanding of what IFAs do and the environment in which they work. You want to sound out ideas from them and get their advice. The problem is that they are legally liable for their advice. Say she recommended an action based on her belief that shares were going to crash and you acted on that advice, if it went wrong you could sue her. So any advice must be documented, with a clear audit trail based on facts.

You would be dealing with a tradesman like a solicitor, dentist, plumber or whatever. They have a job to do which is based on standard routines applied to specific situations. Like plumbers a few of whom fleece old ladies for changing tap washers there will be some who act unethically, but most want to do a good job and get fairly paid for it. Just like you, assuming you work.

Let's take the plumber analogy further. If you wanted to you could DIY. If you didnt feel up to the job you would get one in and leave them to fix the problem which he could discuss with you, then pay the bill. You wouldnt get very far and might not get very helpful replies if you just wanted to discuss the relative merits of particular pipe fittings or what the prospects were for carbon fibre in the industry. And the last thing you would want is a plumber who "questions the system"!!

As to The Book. Sorry I have read Tim Hales and disagree with the single minded passive approach he advocates. It would annoy rather than enlighten me. I have plenty more useful things to read. For intelligent and knowledgeable discussion (and a fair bit of the opposite) your best bet is the internet forums, either here or MotleyFool if you really wanted to get into the details.

Linton

mj62mj62 wrote: »

......
I too am a software developer and i really enjoy the banter with a fellow geek over the most elegant, getting the most performance, supportability etc.
...

A better analogy is someone with their first PC who had read on the net that Microsoft had deliberately slowed PCs down to help the manufacturers and that any software not written in C++ was inherently bug-ridden and unreliable. Perhaps spending a hour's discussion with them, even if they paid you, might be a little less enticing.