HMRC Payment NIERS query

sgsg

I work for the Local Council.

Thanks

Mack1

Hello, I have just received my first payslip and noted the same payment has been deducted and did not understand it so found this thread on Google search.
It seems to be a regular thing so I assume it must be right, however I would be interested to know if you have found anything further.
I am an agency worker and classed as self-employed through G4S but use another company to deal with my pay for tax purposes who charge me £60 pm for doing this, I only signed up to them as they seemed to indicate they would save me tax by offsetting other expenses such as mileage, lunch etc.. To be honest I didn't mind doing this as it saves me messing about with tax returns as I have another income from a pension. But if there is something wrong with what they are doing I would love to hear.

sgsg

I have emailed the umbrella company to find out more about the HMRC payment NIERS.. It is quite frustrating though because it is just like being tax'ed twice!

The umbrella company did not mention this to me... They just told me I would have to pay them £60 a month in which they would deal with my tax and n.i etc but I would benefit due to being able to offset expenses etc... I obviously fell for the whole sales pitch thing as it turns out there is more to it!

Russe11

sgsg wrote: »

I work for the Local Council.

Thanks


The umbrella company did not mention this to me... They just told me I would have to pay them £60 a month in which they would deal with my tax and n.i etc but I would benefit due to being able to offset expenses etc... I obviously fell for the whole sales pitch thing as it turns out there is more to it!

Well you don't have any expenses do you?, well have any expenses be listed on your payadvice? or have you submitted any expenses?

I'd assume you would get a lesser rate working PAYE?

Do you get holiday entitlement?

The umbrella company are not doing anything wrong... just you are not gaining anything because you don't have any expenses.

Happens time and time again on this forum, people ask the same questions, generally using an umbrella company is not sutible for those who are on low wage rates with no expenses.

It can be beneficial if you have expenses and your earning enough to make paying a £60 fee worthwhile.

Commando30601

Good morning guys

My son is in th esame boat, he is working via an Agency and paying HMRC NIERS as well. Along with that he is paying something called MARGINs as well on Company Deductions.
Anyone help?

AI understand it, if you work for an agency they get lets say£50 a month of each person they place, plus they get paid by the company who is using thier temp. Good scam it sounds like.
Pete

Princie

I have a similar issue. I worked for a construction company via an agency. The agency told me I HAD to be paid through a third party company and recommended me. The "umbrella" company said I could claim for mileage and subsitance due to my hours and times away from home. When I recieved my pay slip these were not present. They told me they would only show a deduction from my basic pay so I did not pay tax on my expenses. I also noticed that they did not pay any holiday entitlement and they deducted the NIERS, employers NI contribution, from my wages. when querying this they said they were working correctly. The end client offered me more hours to cover the fuel costs, between 800 and 1200 miles per week, but could not do anything about the unbrella company's policy. I spoke to ACAS who informed me that the holiday pay system is known as "rolled-up pay" and was outlawed by the European Courts of Justice a few years ago and the UK followed suit within the Agency Workers Regulations Act 2013. This can be found at; web address .gov.uk/holiday-entitlement-rights/holiday-pay-the-basics The Citizens Advice Bureau informed me that NIERS should not be deducted from an employee's wages for any reason and a deduction from wages that has not been made fully clear and agreed by the employee is an "unlawful deduction" The unbrella company do not accept this. Probably because they feel the "little guy" can't do anything and will be bullied by comments such as "Be careful, you can be replaced tomorrow"!!! My Tribunal hearing is 15th January. I'll let you know how I get on

agrinnall

Of course the umbrella company don't accept what the CAB are saying about employers NI, because the CAB haven't got a clue what they are talking about. this is the way that umbrella companies work, if you don't like it then I suggest you find yourself a job where you can either be properly self employed or you are an employee on PAYE.

What are you claiming for at a tribunal? I can't see anything in what you've said, apart perhaps from the holiday pay issue, that has been done wrong.

Princie

Sounds like you've had a bad experience with CAB! Her Majesty's Courts and Tribunal Service, however, do listen to the opinions of CAB, especially when they quote Acts and Regulations. This is supported by the same, and the departures, by ACAS. If the common man, such as I, can't rely on their guidance what chance do we have. I feel their guidance is better than a free for all discussion at the pub!!! My issues are; I was told I could claim mileage for my work travel. I don't understand why a company can expect someone to travel, on average, about a thousand miles a week visiting various clients across the East Midlands and Anglia at their own cost. The holiday issue is clearly stated at the web address given that "rolled up" holiday pay is unlawful. And the NIERS is the employers liability. With regard to your comment about my employment status, the umbrella company gave me a contract stating that I was EMPLOYED a by them on a PAYE basis. I think that clears up you're points and thank you for you're input. It made me double check everything. I have already been through the requirement of early conciliation via ACAS. Had a pre hearing assessment, and the Judge feels their is a case to answer. Thus, I have a hearing date!

agrinnall

Well, unless you're expecting a vast amount of precedent to be overturned then you're in for a disappointment.

As I have said, if you work for an umbrella company you are responsible for paying the Employer's NI. Perhaps in your case the umbrella company have made a complete mess of their contract with you, but many thousands of people work in the same way as you and they all pay the Employer's NI.

But don't bother listening to anyone else, feel free to do your own thing, although it would be nice if you'd come back after your tribunal and tell us the result.

And I've had no experience with the CAB, but they are by no means experts in everything, as was proved when they tried to run a board on here.

Princie

Thanks, I do appreciate the input. I have to try as I do feel they have made a bit of a hash up. I will surely let my outcome be known. It may change things for many, or stop others wasting their time.