More hardworking taxpayers about to offshore - New property tax inbound.

Turnbull2000

You'd have to be seriously deluded to believe a 'mansion' tax or higher council tax band will go ahead. Osborne and Cameron will be fiercely opposed, especially as they want to be seen as on the side of 'hardworking homeowners' and not risk upsetting a key voter group - the older and asset rich.

PaulF81

grizzly1911 wrote: »

Looks like they have binned the mansion tax idea PaulF81.

They are after your pension contributions now. Apparently they might reduce your tax free element from £250k to £50k pa. (FT):eek:

Seems more than sufficient to stash each year.

Next it will be reduce it to basic rate relief.

This has been on the cards for a while; a financial adviser I know has been warning about this for a while. 50K is still quite a lot to make really in any year to shove in a pension; much better to just stick it all on spread betting and pay no tax on it whatsoever. :rotfl:

You could also use your shares ISA allowance to bump the allowance a bit further?

MacMickster

PaulF81 wrote: »

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9686083/Tax-raid-on-Britains-rich-in-next-few-weeks-Vince-Cable-says.html



I contribute enough already. I want to see more lazy people starve or at least not get as clinically obese before they tax me more heavily. This will definitely push many a UK tax payer away from the uk. If this effects my income band, or house valuation band, I am off, and with me my tax.

So you are off, and with you your tax. The only thing keeping you in this country is not being taxed much on your property.

I,for one, will not be too sorry to see you (and your like) and your tax go.

Many of those who threaten to leave would vacate jobs and the associated salaries when they left, which would be filled by someone who would continue paying the tax.

We have been threatened with an exodus of the rich from the UK for as long as I have been alive. Now it seems that we are being threatened with an exodus of not the wealthy, but the comfortable middle classes with their band F properties. Laughable!

ognum

How will this work, won't all homes have to be revalued, I believe and stand to be corrected that the present bands work on valuations from many years ago.

how will they know if a home is worth a million plus or a million minus a bit?

The cost of rebranding will be enormous and I can't believe that if. New bands are created that lesser bands can be left the same there will have to be a mass shifting so I will be interested to see how it works out in practice!

Percy1983

I quite like the idea of mansion tax ...looks at council tax band A invoice for £884.66 and smiles...

vivatifosi

ognum wrote: »

How will this work, won't all homes have to be revalued, I believe and stand to be corrected that the present bands work on valuations from many years ago.

how will they know if a home is worth a million plus or a million minus a bit?

The cost of rebranding will be enormous and I can't believe that if. New bands are created that lesser bands can be left the same there will have to be a mass shifting so I will be interested to see how it works out in practice!

As I understand it, and this is only from the Mail, they will only be rebanding houses in bands G and H. It is possible that this may also only impact on houses in England, as Wales and Scotland (and I think NI) have their own banding systems.

The number of houses in these bands are relatively small.
This dataset, which uses government data from 2011, shows that only 3.51% of houses in England are in band G and only 0.57% are in band H. Not surprisingly, the largest percentages of these dwellings are to be found in London and the South East.

I have previously appealed council tax and it has been a laborious process in terms of showing the value for 1991/1993. However since then, house price data has become much easier to obtain due to the growth of databases at places such as the Land Registry, the impact of the internet and growth of sites such as nethouseprices, zoopla, etc. I'd therefore expect a lot of valuations will be based on recent sales (bear in mind the new bands reflect values now, not 20 odd years ago), and rather than having agents doing drive by valuations, there will be people and computers in rooms analysing datasets and devising algorithms.

ETA: link to dataset not working, this should work:
http://www.neighbourhood.statistics.gov.uk/dissemination/viewFullDataset.do?JSAllowed=true&Function=&%24ph=61&CurrentPageId=63&step=4&productId=938&instanceSelection=029870&timeId=354&containerAreaId=276699&startColumn=1&revisionStatus=&numberOfColumns=21&javaScriptEnabled=true&selectable=false&metadataInNewWindow=true&optionalMetadataShown=true&disclaimerShown=false&headingTruncationEnabled=true&dropdownSelectionEnabled=true&overrideCellFormat=&footnoteDisplayEnabled=true&language=English&showTotals=false&unhide=false&paginate=off&paginateCols=6&page=1&sortId=0&sortFunction=off&sortType=0&sortOrder=0&lastCutID=&lastCutType=&tableTitle=&selectedType=&selectedID=

ognum

vivatifosi wrote: »

As I understand it, and this is only from the Mail, they will only be rebanding houses in bands G and H. It is possible that this may also only impact on houses in England, as Wales and Scotland (and I think NI) have their own banding systems.

The number of houses in these bands are relatively small.
This dataset, which uses government data from 2011, shows that only 3.51% of houses in England are in band G and only 0.57% are in band H. Not surprisingly, the largest percentages of these dwellings are to be found in London and the South East.

I have previously appealed council tax and it has been a laborious process in terms of showing the value for 1991/1993. However since then, house price data has become much easier to obtain due to the growth of databases at places such as the Land Registry, the impact of the internet and growth of sites such as nethouseprices, zoopla, etc. I'd therefore expect a lot of valuations will be based on recent sales (bear in mind the new bands reflect values now, not 20 odd years ago), and rather than having agents doing drive by valuations, there will be people and computers in rooms analysing datasets and devising algorithms.

ETA: link to dataset not working, this should work:
http://www.neighbourhood.statistics.gov.uk/dissemination/viewFullDataset.do?JSAllowed=true&Function=&%24ph=61&CurrentPageId=63&step=4&productId=938&instanceSelection=029870&timeId=354&containerAreaId=276699&startColumn=1&revisionStatus=&numberOfColumns=21&javaScriptEnabled=true&selectable=false&metadataInNewWindow=true&optionalMetadataShown=true&disclaimerShown=false&headingTruncationEnabled=true&dropdownSelectionEnabled=true&overrideCellFormat=&footnoteDisplayEnabled=true&language=English&showTotals=false&unhide=false&paginate=off&paginateCols=6&page=1&sortId=0&sortFunction=off&sortType=0&sortOrder=0&lastCutID=&lastCutType=&tableTitle=&selectedType=&selectedID=

Thanks for this it is interesting, I do however believe the rebranding of 4% of homes will just be the start, if it proves easy to rebrand these then almost certainly there will be a drop down effect.

vivatifosi

ognum wrote: »

Thanks for this it is interesting, I do however believe the rebranding of 4% of homes will just be the start, if it proves easy to rebrand these then almost certainly there will be a drop down effect.

There could well be. If that happens though, it isn't necessarily a bad thing. During that time, some areas have come up more than average, others have gone down more than average.

At the moment I think it is a political sop to show we're all in this together, without costing much or affecting many people. There have been too many plans for wholesale rebanding abandoned in the past for it to follow hot on the heels. Though never say never, it will happen one day, just a matter of when.

grizzly1911

ognum wrote: »

Thanks for this it is interesting, I do however believe the rebranding of 4% of homes will just be the start, if it proves easy to rebrand these then almost certainly there will be a drop down effect.

Why would they need to do anything with those below G?

Whilst they may be based on a valuation assessment from the 90s there relative position as a property won't be much different. If the properties get reassessed the bands would also have to be reassessed upwards.

If a property was in band F originally there would be little reason for it not to be in band F now, unless it had received significant additions. With the distortion in values in London/SE the start and finish points of each band may be different to the NW but the actual houses in each band can remain. I can't believe there are many houses actually cross those boundaries relative to the total number.

It is only the top end properties that need to be reconsidered.

As viva says there are much better modelling systems available than before.

As reported on the news yesterday this isn't going to see the light of day anyway at this time.

ognum

I would be very happy to see a revaluation of the entire housing stock, I think there are actually a lot of houses that have increased in size and value through extension and loft conversions etc. It should be legally required to report all home improvements so that reassessment could take place.

I would be surprised it the rebranding of F and G goes ahead with this government, there must be many people who have slowly crept into the million pound home level. But they are probably Tory voters!