Very awkward and odd employment reference situation

[Deleted User]

Any advice appreciated. I have employed a solicitor and he seems quite good but I'm skeptical about this one issue.

I recently started working for a FTSE 250 company as a senior project manager. To get the offer I had to supply 2 references - they came back good and I got the job. I was very happy.

3 weeks in, enjoying the work and good relationship with boss, I am approached by Loss Control whose job it is to cover losses of all kinds be that staff dishonesty, vouchers going missing, or that systems aren't leaking information to rivals etc.

I get asked to a room and heavily interrogated for an hour by an ex-policeman who heads up the department.

I'm asked all sorts about what money I live off, where I've been living, why I left particular jobs, and if if I lied about having a clean criminal record. They think I'm a fraudster. He tells me that they followed up with my last employer (I didn't supply them as a reference as it was a references up front job) and they came back "unsatisfactory".

He said I am accused of leaving the company without telling anyone and that files went missing. Scary stuff.

I get asked to leave the building immediately.

The next day the same guy came to my house to drop off my personal belongings and asked me to sign a statement about the meeting.

I was happy to as it was exactly what happened.

This statement is then officially emailed to me from his email account specifically saying that "it was explained to me that I left the previous employer without telling anyone and that files had gone missing".

I asked him if the reference was written or verbal and he said "both". I have done a freedom of information request for it but this will take time and as you'll see, it might not come to anything.

So I employ a solicitor to approach the referee.

Letter/email straight back that they never said any such thing and that I issued notice and an end date was agreed but I didn't tell them I was leaving the building at 17:30 (home time) and that I didn't finish some work (I had 3 hours warning it was the last day) and that the verbal reference has been misinterpreted and that I was difficult to manage AFTER I resigned while they tried to stay on and not resign.

My solicitor says the testimony I have is not strong enough without the written reference.

As you can imagine I am completely distraught especially given the game of claims from both sides.

If the written reference doesn't turn up it's going to get messy and in the mean time I'm unemployed and potentially unemployable!

Uncertain

It would be a subject access request (SAR) under the Data Protection Act to attempt to get the reference from the recipient. Freedom of Information is something different and not relevant.

The problem is that documents can get "lost" when convenient and the DPA is a fairly toothless tiger on matters like this.

Initially all you can do is wait the prescribed time (40 days from memory) then complain to the Information Commissioner if it is not forthcoming.

InsideInsurance

What is the one issue you are skeptical about? And will you really trust an anonymous public forum over a fully trained and qualified solicitor?

First of all you cannot do a Freedom of Information request, even if the organisation you are talking about is a public body, because you are wanting individual data and the response to an FoI cannot identify individuals.

What you want to do is a Subject Access Request for £10 under the Data Protection Act. You can try doing this to both organisations however only the company that fired you must provide it, the company that wrote it may chose to send it but technically it is exempt from the act for them.

Once you get a copy of it from the new employer then you can evidently decide what you want to do. It could be that the person you spoke to at the prior employer isnt the person that actually provided the reference. Was this person your ex line manager or HR? How big is the old employer (you mention the new one is a FTSE 250 so reasonable sized)?

It could well be that HR has done the reference simply from a exit interview sheet from your line manager and has interpreted something in a certain way and then the new employers have interpreted it in a certain way as well and has spoken to this chap and he's interpreted what they've said in a certain way etc (ie chinese whispers/ death by a thousand cuts)


What do you actually want to achieve out of all this though?

[Deleted User]

Thanks. I'll have to sit tight and hope they actually do it quickly (who am I kidding?) and hope it turns up with those claims on it.

[Deleted User]

InsideInsurance wrote: »

What is the one issue you are skeptical about? And will you really trust an anonymous public forum over a fully trained and qualified solicitor?

First of all you cannot do a Freedom of Information request, even if the organisation you are talking about is a public body, because you are wanting individual data and the response to an FoI cannot identify individuals.

What you want to do is a Subject Access Request for £10 under the Data Protection Act. You can try doing this to both organisations however only the company that fired you must provide it, the company that wrote it may chose to send it but technically it is exempt from the act for them.

Once you get a copy of it from the new employer then you can evidently decide what you want to do. It could be that the person you spoke to at the prior employer isnt the person that actually provided the reference. Was this person your ex line manager or HR? How big is the old employer (you mention the new one is a FTSE 250 so reasonable sized)?

It could well be that HR has done the reference simply from a exit interview sheet from your line manager and has interpreted something in a certain way and then the new employers have interpreted it in a certain way as well and has spoken to this chap and he's interpreted what they've said in a certain way etc (ie death by a thousand cuts)


What do you actually want to achieve out of all this though?

Apologies for using the wrong term. You're right. Luckily I used a template and did the SAR request.

Old employer is around £4million turnover company. New employer is FTSE250 (e.g. around £1billion in revenue each year).

It was the HR Manager that wrote it.

Death by a thousand cuts sounds like a possibility although that thought obviously makes me feel sick in the stomach.

The guy from the FTSE250 company said "off-the-record" that I could get my job back if I sort it out but I think it was an empty promise.

Top priority is the job but although I'd rather work I am now unemployed with a sacking on my record over something I didn't do and even a letter that I didn't do it so clearly damages are clearly on my mind as my career could be trashed.

InsideInsurance

[quote=[Deleted User];57089995]Apologies for using the wrong term. You're right. Luckily I used a template and did the SAR request.[/QUOTE]

To which company?

As said, it is only the NEW company that MUST provide it.... the old company has no legal requirement to provide it to you under the DPA


What industry do you work in? How many years experience as a PM/ Senior PM?

An associate got sacked as a PM from an organisation after a very short time (but he was guilty of what he was accused of) and so took the opportunity to go contracting and just never put the last company on his CV and when asked to explain he said he knew people wanted contractors that are available immediately and so quit his job, went on holiday and then came back to job hunting.

In 10 years of working with contractors, never known a single one to be formally referenced

[Deleted User]

InsideInsurance wrote: »

To which company?

As said, it is only the NEW company that MUST provide it.... the old company has no legal requirement to provide it to you under the DPA


What industry do you work in? How many years experience as a PM/ Senior PM?

An associate got sacked as a PM from an organisation after a very short time (but he was guilty of what he was accused of) and so took the opportunity to go contracting and just never put the last company on his CV and when asked to explain he said he knew people wanted contractors that are available immediately and so quit his job, went on holiday and then came back to job hunting.

In 10 years of working with contractors, never known a single one to be formally referenced

It was to the new company. I have around 5 years PM experience.

Thanks for the positive messages. I hope you're right. I am trying for jobs right now.

I definitely don't want to play the victim but this does seem pretty serious to me.

Acc72

Uncertain wrote: »

The problem is that documents can get "lost" when convenient and the DPA is a fairly toothless tiger on matters like this.

Unfortunatley from experience I agree with the above.

In addition, rather than spend all your time and energies with this approach I would advise being more positive.

Your main objective is to stay in your current job.

Is it not possible to speak with the new employer with a view to retaining your job ? - speak with your manager direct who can help you with regards to dealing with HR and "Loss Control".

You could explain that there must be a mix up (which will be resolved with their help - i.e. reference).

In the meantime would it be possible for you to continue in your role to prove that you are the right person for the job.

Obviously if you could provide other employer and character references if they require.