overpayment

starlet_1961

I'm in a bit of a mess and I'm hoping that someone may be able to offer some advice.

In November 2009 I started a new job. In Jan 2010, the company asked me to reduce my days from five per week to three. This was to be for a period of three months. In April 2010, I asked if I could remain on three days per week. This was agreed.

In November 2010, the company informed me that they had been paying me for five days per week, rather than three, between January and November.

I didn't realize that I was being over paid because I knew that my hours were sent to the pay office correctly each week (by my manager). Also, I didn't receive a contract of employment, stating my hourly rate, until I had been with the company for six months. This was despite repeated requests. In addition the payslips don't indicate the hours that we have been payed for. As I had only just started work at the company, I'd had no previous pay slips as a comparison (my first payslip had been for part of the month and was a bit of a muddle).

I had asked to stay on three days per week based on what I thought I was earning. Later, I sold my house and got a small mortgage. Again, this was based on what I thought I was earning.

I agreed to repay them at £50.00 per month, which I know isn't a lot, but given my mortgage situation and with me being on less pay than I thought, it was all I could afford.

The payments were being taken monthly as agreed and all seemed fine.

However, I handed in my notice in October 2012. I offered to continue the payments via a my bank, but the company refused, saying it wasn't enough. My October payslip arrived as usual on the last Friday of the month, showing the correct pay (with the £50.00 deduction). When I went to the bank, I discovered that the company had taken my entire months wages.

At work on the day after payday, I discovered that the pay office had sent me an email two days before, stating that they'd take October and Novembers wages towards the over payment. As I was to be working my notice in October and November, I'd assumed that this was the period they were giving me forewarning about.

I'm not disputing the over payment or paying them back, but especially bearing in mind that I had been paying back an agreed amount monthly, is the company correct in taking all of my wages without warning? This has left me in severe financial hardship, to the point of being in danger of not being able to pay my mortgage.

Sorry if this has been a bit long.

Many thanks, Starlet

MissSarah1972

If you your company anything before you leave they can take it back as they are not really going to let you leave their employ and still you owe them, are they?

Did you really not know you were still getting 100% of your salary compared to 60% that you should have gone down too?

PS - all deductions should be shown on the payslips

Are you sure they have not just put a stop on the pay or totally not paid you at all? What was the net you were expecting and how much do you still owe them?

starlet_1961

Thank you for your reply, Miss Sarah.

I had offered to continue repaying them as already arranged.

I'd not the faintest idea that I was being overpaid, as explained in my post. I genuinely took the pay in good faith. Had I known that I was being overpaid, I would have told them immediately and I definitely wouldn't have changed my circumstances. I had never been told my hourly rate and the company discourages staff members from disclosing theirs as everyone is on different rates of pay.

No deduction was shown on the last payslip apart from the usual monthly amount.

MissSarah1972

starlet_1961 wrote: »

Thank you for your reply, Miss Sarah.

I had offered to continue repaying them as already arranged.

I'd not the faintest idea that I was being overpaid, as explained in my post. I genuinely took the pay in good faith. Had I known that I was being overpaid, I would have told them immediately and I definitely wouldn't have changed my circumstances. I had never been told my hourly rate and the company discourages staff members from disclosing theirs as everyone is on different rates of pay.

No deduction was shown on the last payslip apart from the usual monthly amount.

You had NEVER been told your hourly rate? LOL Seriously? So how did you ever know your pay was correct?

hcb42

I dont think there is a lot you can do, other than relying on goodwill.

You cannot force them to pay you, they have overpaid you for your time there, the hardship is not their problem.

After they took what they owed, do you owe anything else that they will pursue you for, or has that cleared the debt.

sunflower_2

a sort of similar situation happened when my hubby left a previous job - they deducted apx £200 from his final pay to cover cost of the Christmas party we would no longer be attending (they pay for the employee and partner).

i emailed the company and demanded to know who had made the decision and asked for a copy of their Grievance Procedure.
the money was refunded into the bank within a few days.

whilst you agree you owe them the money - i really dont think its fair to take your whole monthly wage without sufficient notice (2 days before payday?? is shocking in my opinion).

as for not noticing the extra 2 days pay - did you not get paid during nov 09 and jan 10?
i suppose it would depend on how much we are talking about and what the job was as to whether i would notice
e.g. if we are talking £800 for 3 days' work as a shop assistant - i would know this was too much.

zzzLazyDaisy

starlet_1961 wrote: »

In November 2009 I started a new job. In Jan 2010, the company asked me to reduce my days from five per week to three. This was to be for a period of three months. In April 2010, I asked if I could remain on three days per week. This was agreed.

You worked 5 days a week from November to January, and were paid accordingly.

You then reduced your hours to three days a week, which would have meant a reduction of 2/5ths of your wages - so you would have expected to be earning almost half what you were on full-time. Yet you did not notice that there was no corresponding drop in your income?

The law relating to unlawful deduction of wages has an express exemption for overpayment of wages. In other words, if an overpayment is made by mistake, the employer is entitled to recover it. There is nothing, to stop the employer recovering the whole amount in one go, but most employers will come to an arrangement with the employee to allow repayment by installments via deductions from the employee's wages, although they are not legally obliged to do this.

In leaving before the debt has been cleared, you have also failed to keep your side of the agreement - that this money would be deducted from your wages until the debt is cleared. When you decided to leave, you knew that you still owed this money, yet you went ahead and handed in your notice without first speaking to your employer to establish how they would expect this money to be repaid, if you were no longer employed by them.

The bottom line is that they are entitled to with-hold this money from your final wages. You have no recourse or complaint to a tribunal, owing to the express exemption in the legislation covering over-payments.

However, the wage slip should accurately reflect all deductions. You should certainly follow this up and get the discrepancy corrected, because at the moment there is no official record of the deduction and this could lead to complications later.

One other thing that does cross my mind is that during the initial overpayment period you would have been paying tax and NI on the higher rate. You need to check that they have been taking back the overpayment out of your gross pay, and not your net pay, as otherwise you will effectively be paying tax and NI twice.

Savvy_Sue

starlet_1961 wrote: »

I had offered to continue repaying them as already arranged.

Yes, but they can't enforce that once you've left, can they? You cancel the SO, move away, change your bank account - they have no way of getting in touch with you. LazyDaisy is right, they can do this.

ohreally

starlet_1961 wrote: »

In Jan 2010, the company asked me to reduce my days from five per week to three

I would put it to the company that they absorb this period, if they were responsible for the reduction in hours without agreement from yourself. What was the reason for this?

MissSarah1972

ohreally wrote: »

I would put it to the company that they absorb this period, if they were responsible for the reduction in hours without agreement from yourself. What was the reason for this?

The op said ' In April 2010, I asked if I could remain on three days per week'

ohreally

MissSarah1972 wrote: »

The op said ' In April 2010, I asked if I could remain on three days per week'

And?

I'm referring to the period the employer reduced the working hours.